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Contents Bulletin Scripting in shell and Perl Network troubleshooting History Humor

Midnight Commander version 4.8

News Orthodox File Managers Recommended Links Ebook Orthodox File Manager(OFM) Paradigm mcedit- Midnight Commander editor mcview Context Sensitive User Menu MC Extension menu
Macro Substitution Command line and command window External panelize  History of commands Colorizing      
Cheetsheet OFM Standards OFM Standard 1999  Tips MC History

OFM YouTube Tutorials

Humor Etc

Midnight Commander (mc) is one of the most popular Unix command line Orthodox File Managers (OFMs) and in various version it is available in compiled form for all major UNIX flavors as well as in Windows with Cygwin installed. This is a pretty old implementation, with development started in 1994 and major features implemented around 1998 (in version 4.1.35). It was little changed since them.

The most popular version is version 4.6.2.pre1 created around 2006 which available from the installation DVD for SLES 10 and 11 as well as RHEL 5 and 6. As you understand that means there was not much development since this version. Still some progress was achieved when in late 2009 Slava Zanko became a maintainer and moved the development to a new site www.midnight-commander.org  A better, newer version 4.8.x series (the latest stable version is 4.8.1.7) has improved internal editor and viewer and better implementation of Ctrl-O (switch to terminal window) command.  As of November 2012 it is available in precompiled from with the standard installation DVD ISO only with selected distributions (Debian, Ubuntu, Gentoo and Cygwin). 

There is also  a "cutting edge" development version (4.8.7 as of November 2012) with night build available for download and testing. It is interesting mainly for those who want to in some way to participate in mc development (and project does need additional human resources in this area) as well as "beta-addicts".

In well trained hands, mc like other OFMs is extremely efficient, enabling the user to shuffle huge number of files with a minimum of keystrokes. Switch from Windows OFM like FAR or Total Commander is not without problems as mc has a lot of idiosyncrasies but basic compatibility is present. It also allow to perform pretty complex operations with files, simplifying and speeding up such operation in comparison with usage of Unix command line tools. Provided visual feedback is very helpful too (but this visual feedback is somewhat crippled in mc as it can't operate in "half-screen" mode with half screen allocated to panels and half to shell terminal window).  

For Unix sysadmins who never used OFMs before tapping to mc power has a price. There is no free lunch and mc does has a rather steep learning curve. The same is actually true about vi, which looks completely foreign to people who get used to Windows-style editors. BTW vi can be called  a representative of Orthodox file editors and there are Orthodox-style file managers which imitate vi keyboard bindings. Actually, those two utilities (mc and vi) have many things in common, including the use of the keyboard for most operations, availability of command line and related command set as well as the use of regular expressions.

Like any OFM, mc should be better viewed as  an extension of the command line capabilities of the shell -- a new generation of the shell interface for the Unix environment.  But initial developers did not have this understanding and architecture of  Midnight Commander does not allow full implementation of this idea. It remains crippled althouth in version 4.8.1 it is less crippled then in previous version.

If and when command windows capability becomes "first class citizen" in GNU screen manner (and actually there is great, completely untapped synergy between those two projects), mc might provide a real power tool to system administrators, or for anyone who need to work with shell scripts and manipulate the large number of files. Currently it is still mostly file manager, not so much a sysadmin IDE, a status to which any self-respected OFM should strive ;-).  It is perfect for performing operations on a number of selected files but is crippled for as a shell terminal.  See also my ebook discussion for more details. 

It has been said that the secret of success and longevity of Unix is connected not so much with the operating system itself but with the philosophy, key ideas and the whole the way of thinking (Unix paradigm, or "Unix way") behind it. In The UNIX Programming Environment, Kernighan and Pike noted that the essence of Unix philosophy "is the idea that the power of a system comes more from the relationships among programs than from the programs themselves."

One such capability to combine power many small scripts is present in mc in the form of user menu and extension menu. For some reason the key capability of OFMs: the ability to create your own custom user menu and extension menu is deemphasized in mc documentation. But mc does provide rich and up-to-date set of default user menu entries and extension menu that can serve as template for your own development efforts.

User menu has a minimal interface but allows small script and programs to be strung together in pipelines to do jobs that no single program could do alone.

Most operating systems -- including modern Unix and Linux systems -- have graphical interfaces that are powerful and a pleasure to use. But none of them provide power and flexibility of classic Unix pipes and filters glued by the programming power of the shell.

Usually Unix administrators quickly learn how to use basic shell functionality and stop their. We seldom acquire skills we can do without. OFM like mc, on the other hand, teaches shell programming in a very deep and subtle way as a slow but steady extension of the work you do simply by extending your own set of user menu and extension menu entries. Faced with a choice between an hour spent on a boring, repetitive task and an hour putting together a script that will do the task, many eventually will choose the latter.

Another mc strength is that it permits quickly solve a typical file manipulation tasks that constitute a large percentage of a typical load for system administrators and power users. Providing much better visibility of those operations that command line it also prevent many painful mistakes and blunders. Thus MC should be viewed as a natural extension of the Unix shell and any user should put some effort into adapting bash scripts in the user menu and integrating their own "quick-fixes" for common problems.

Starting from version 4.8 Midnight commander more correctly (but still with flaws) implements the second fundamental property of OFMs -- "first class citizen" implementation of command windows which make if more attractive for UNIX system administrators. Here is a relevant quote from the main page:

One "terminal style" windows that initially is minimized to a single line at the bottom but can be expanded to full screen, half-screen or any number of lines (classic Norton Commander provided two preselected sizes: half screen and full screen, FAR introduced the ability to expand command line windows by any number of lines necessary/optimal).  At least the ability hide panel and work with full screen command windows should be present. Unfortunately this feature is very poorly understood and as such is very poorly implemented (paradoxically it is implemented especially bad in Unix OFMs). At the same time this is what makes OFM close to visual shell -- as you can use environment variables and shortcuts related to panels in command line. This is a really unique feature of OFM.  Unfortunately implementation is completely screwed in Midnight Commander -- the leading Unix OFM and capability to extend the third windows is completely absent from Total Commander -- probably the best GUI-based OFM for Windows. So again the key feature of orthodox file managers is very badly implemented with the exception of the original Norton Commander and FAR.  This ability to paste elements (current file, path to left and right panel, list of selected files, etc) from panel from it using keyboard shortcuts simplifies many operations in comparison with both die hard command line Unix users on one hand and GUI-addicted CDD (click-drag-drop) type of Windows users on the other.

This "visual shell" memo is one of the most powerful ideas within OFM paradigm, but unfortunately "the religion became corrupted" as it often happens. Only FAR and Midnight commander (starting from version 4.8 produced by Slava Zanko team; in versions up to 4.6 it was a dirty hack, not a real implementation) implement this idea correctly, but with different strong point of the implementation:

At the same time such a popular implementation as Total Commander is completely defective in this respect: the third command line allow only a single command to be executed and output is not visible other that (if this is command affects file in the panel) in changes in listed in panels files.

Midnight Commander also has a correct implementation of user menu concept:

Additional way of integration with the underling OS shell via so called User menu and extension menu using the same set of macro variables that are available for command line. This way "user menu" provide a user with he capability to write his own simple extensions some of which can be quite useful. Here is an example taken from Midnight Commander User menu (which has a unique feature that it is dynamic and only those items of the menu that are applicable to the current file type and presence/absence of selected files are shown to the user): 

= t r
+ ! t 
y       Gzip or unzip current file
        unset DECOMP
	case %f in
	    *.gz) DECOMP=-d;;
	    *.[zZ]) DECOMP=-d;;
	esac
        gzip $DECOMP -v %f

+ t t
Y       Gzip or gunzip tagged files
        for i in %t
        do
          unset DECOMP
	  case "$i" in
	    *.gz) DECOMP=-d;;
	    *.[zZ]) DECOMP=-d;;
	  esac
          gzip $DECOMP -v "$i"
        done


+ f \.tar.gz$ | f \.tgz$ | f \.tpz$ | f \.tar.Z$ | f \.tar.z$ | f \.tar.bz2$ | f \.tar.F$ & t r & ! t t
z       Extract compressed tar file to subdirectory
	unset D
	set gzip -cd
	case %f in
	  *.tar.gz) D="`basename %f .tar.gz`";;
	  *.tgz)    D="`basename %f .tgz`";;
	  *.tpz)    D="`basename %f .tpz`";;
	  *.tar.Z)  D="`basename %f .tar.Z`";;
	  *.tar.z)  D="`basename %f .tar.z`";;
	  *.tar.bz2) D="`basename %f .tar.bz2`"; set bunzip2 -c ;;
	  *.tar.F) D="`basename %f .tar.F`"; set freeze -dc;
	esac
	mkdir "$D"; cd "$D" && ("$1" "$2" ../%f | tar xvf -)

+ t t
Z       Extract compressed tar files to subdirectories
	for i in %t
        do
	  set gzip -dc
          unset D
	  case "$i" in
	    *.tar.gz)  D="`basename $i .tar.gz`";;
	    *.tgz)     D="`basename $i .tgz`";;
	    *.tpz)     D="`basename $i .tpz`";;
	    *.tar.Z)   D="`basename $i .tar.Z`";;
	    *.tar.z)   D="`basename $i .tar.z`";;
	    *.tar.F)   D="`basename $i .tar.F`"; set freeze -dc;;
	    *.tar.bz2) D="`basename $i .tar.bz2`"; set bunzip2 -c;;
          esac
	  mkdir "$D"; (cd "$D" && "$1" "$2" "../$i" | tar xvf -)
        done

This idea of user menu was extended to the mc internal editor which has an additional macro variable %b to which you can direct the output of shell command for insertion into editor buffer and vise versa.  This is a valuable innovation. Generally in version 4.8.1 editor looks more promising and more modern then in previous version although it still is lack in quality and capabilities from FTE, which I strongly recommend as an external editor for Midnight Commander.

See Mcedit -- Midnight Commander’s Editor


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Old News ;-)

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[Mar 29, 2017] SDB: Midnight Commander tips

openSUSE
Using the mouse

Although Midnight Commander is a text mode application it can make use of mouse. The openSUSE delivered mc will make use of the mouse when used with a GUI console, without any further configuration needed.

The text mode terminal that we get when booting in runlevels 2 or 3 is a bit different story. You have to install the package gpm ("general purpose mouse") which is also called mouse server. The gpm is used in Linux to receive movements and clicks from mouse. Start gpm and then start Midnight commander.

If you come to the text terminal using Ctrl + Alt + F1, then gpm will not work as another driver that belongs to GUI (X Server) claims control over the mouse.

... ... ...

FTP browsing

This is file browsing on remote FTP server just as it is on your computer.

  1. Press F9 to select drop down menus on the top of the screen.
  2. Press Alt + L if you want to use left side panel, or Alt + R for right panel.
  3. Press Alt + P for input box where you have enter server name. Enter for instance
ftp.gwdg.de/pub

and press Enter.

Now mc will try anonymous connection to remote machine. If machine responds, you'll get directory listing of /pub on remote server.

It is possible to do the same from mc command line by typing:

cd /#ftp:ftp.gwdg.de/pub 

Archive browsing

Archive in classic meaning is compressed file. In Linux you can recognize them by suffix like:

tgz, tar.gz, tbz, tar.bz2

and many more, but above few are the most used

  1. Highlight the file
  2. Press Enter

That's it. Midnight Commander will decompress file for you and present it's internal structure like any other directory. If you want to extract one or all files from archive mark what you want toextract and use F5 to copy in another panel. Done.

RPM browsing

The package installation files for any SUSE are RPM and mc will let you browse them.

  1. Highlight the file
  2. Press Enter

You'll see few files:

/INFO
CONTENTS.cpio
HEADER
*INSTALL
*UPGRADE

Browse to see details of your RPM.

The CONTENTS.cpio is actual archive with files, and if you want to see within:

  1. Highlight the file
  2. Press Enter

(You know the drill)

The *INSTALL and *UPGRADE will do what the name tells, but if you want only to extract one or more files from CONTENTS.cpio than use F5 to copy them in the directory in the other panel.

PuTTY and line drawing

PuTTY is terminal application used to access remote computers running Linux via ssh (SSH tunnels from Microsoft Windows see details). The line drawing in Midnight Commander, YaST and another applications that draw lines using special characters can be displayed wrong as something else. The solution is to change settings:

If that doesn't help, you may set this too:

Found on webmilhouse.com.

User menu (F2 key) add-on

Diffs in color

Tip by James Ogley:

+ t r & ! t t
d       Diff against file of same name in other directory
        if [ "%d" = "%D" ]; then
          echo "The two directores must be different"
          exit 1
        fi
        if [ -f %D/%f ]; then        # if two of them, then
          diff -up %f %D/%f | sed -e 's/\(^-.*\)/\x1b[1;31m\1\x1b[0m/g' \
                                  -e 's/\(^\+.*\)/\x1b[1;32m\1\x1b[0m/g' \
                                  -e 's/\(^@.*\)/\x1b[36m\1\x1b[0m/g' | less -R
        else
          echo %f: No copy in %D/%f
        fi

D       Diff current directory against other directory
        if [ "%d" = "%D" ]; then
          echo "The two directores must be different"
          exit 1
        fi
        diff -up %d %D | sed -e 's/\(^-.*\)/\x1b[1;31m\1\x1b[0m/g' \
                             -e 's/\(^\+.*\)/\x1b[1;32m\1\x1b[0m/g' \
                             -e 's/\(^@.*\)/\x1b[36m\1\x1b[0m/g' | less -R
fi

[Jul 14, 2016] mc-4.8.17 released

Notable quotes:
"... Copy & move operations now use an adaptive buffer, just like the corresponding coreutils commands, which will significantly improve the performance (hopefully!) for many of our users. ..."
www.midnight-commander.org

This is a maintenance release that includes bugfixes for a bunch of very annoying bugs that surfaced in the previous version (FISH, patchfs, segfault and tcsh detection on FreeBSD) and brings several new features.

Copy & move operations now use an adaptive buffer, just like the corresponding coreutils commands, which will significantly improve the performance (hopefully!) for many of our users. Move to the new high-level mouse API has not only simplified our code, but also resolved a number of long-standing mouse bugs. Finally, the new panel centered scrolling mode is weird, but fun; try it out!

For a detailed list of changes since the last version, please refer to the release notes.

Download page: http://ftp.midnight-commander.org/?C=N;O=D

Major changes since 4.8.16

Core

VFS

Editor

Misc

[Jul 14, 2016] Maintenance release of MC with LUA support

typo.co.il
A new release of mc^2 is out. It's mainly a maintenance release,
so there aren't many exciting new features.

    http://www.typo.co.il/~mooffie/mc-lua/docs/html/

News:

The C side:

  - The branch is rebased against mc 4.8.17.

The Lua side:

  - A few minor bug fixes.

  - New module: "dynamic skin"

    It lets you change the skin automatically depending on
    the directory you're in.

    So, for example, when you're examining an old backup disk
    you've mounted, or when you're on a remote machine, or when
    you're browsing a panelized or filtered listing, or when
    you're in a read-only directory, you can get a very
    noticeable visual indication reminding you of this.

  - New module: "colon"

    It lets you type :commands :like :these on the
    command-line (or in the editor). Like in 'vi'.
    E.g., you can rename files by typing:

        :s/\.jpe?g/jpg/i

    (This launches Visual Rename, where you can inspect
    the changes before committing them.)

  - The snapshots module can now save/restore panelized listings.
_______________________________________________
mc-devel mailing list
https://mail.gnome.org/mailman/listinfo/mc-devel

[Jun 04, 2015] Plans for Midnight Commander development

Notable quotes:
"...I want to use the release announcement to call for volunteers to join the team as maintainers to contribute to bug triaging and code review. Hopefully, this helps attract the attention of distro maintainers / packagers and downstream users that do not follow the mailing lists."
"Midnight Commander is not going away; even if commits completely cease, I'm still up to maintaining the website and all thirds-party services, as we've been doing for the last 5-6 years for as long as I can; if this changes, a proper public announcement will be made as early as possible. "

Hi there,

It seems that I'm the only member of the current team left who still wants to go on with the project, so here is my current plan.

Re mc is over! - post by Ilia Maslakov on Russian-speaking IT site

On Sat, May 30, 2015 at 02:47:02PM +0200, Yury V. Zaytsev wrote:
Under these circumstances, I can stick my own (very negative) opinion
of Github issue tracker somewhere deep down, and accept that the tools
are chosen by those people who do the real work. If they like Github
issues and they make them productive, so be it.
i'll use that as a launchpad for some general musings of
state-of-the-art hosting tools i'm aware of. this is an invitation to
discussion, and i find it interesting beyond the scope of mc.


it's obvious at first sight that the github issue tracker provides much
less formal structure than trac. and trac ain't that great to start with
(especially on the workflow side, at least as configured for mc (i
don't know what would be possible with a current version)).

in github, almost everything is done with labels. it's nice and
uncomplicated, but simply doesn't scale.

on the migration side, it seems that it's impossible to fake issue
reporters. incidentally, that's one of the two problems that i fixed
last year in mc's issue import to trac because i found it so annoying.
most advanced import tool i found:
https://github.com/trustmaster/trac2github

i find github's code review system terrible; it doesn't encourage the
workflow i want (every commit being polished), and it doesn't scale,
either.
luckily, there is gerrithub.io to alleviate the problem.


there is also an open-source clone of github: gitlab.
it is really a look-alike, so it has pretty much all downsides of
github, with the addition that no gerrit integration exists (yet).
on the upside, the issue import is probably better. tool:
https://gitlab.com/kevinlee/trac-issues-to-gitlab


there is also bitbucket, but the free version is limited to teams of
five, whatever that may mean in practice. anyone here has experience
with it?
yet another fully integrated solution (for own hosting) would be
phabricator. no personal experience with it, either.

_______________________________________________

Re: "mc is over!?" - post by Ilia Maslakov on Russian-speaking IT site

27.05.2015 13:37, Paul Sokolovsky wrote: 

Hi all,

The current maintainers, namely Andrew Borodin, Slava Zanko, Ilia Maslakov, Sergei Trofimovich - please provide full disclosure of what happens within your team. Whatever it is, please show goodwill by adding Egmont Koblinger to the maintainer team, if he agrees (including discussions and commit access), to show that the project wasn't usurped by Soviet Obkom.

Yes, I confirm that our team as fact has ended to develop mc. Ilia has issues with access to internet from his work, at home he has much stronger priorities with family, the same for Andrew. As for me, I have heavy loading on work, after work I am very busy on building my house. So there is no time for development mc.

And of course, we are opened for any of our wishes to develop mc. Just let me know if someone wants to participate in development and I'll give write access to repo/wiki/transifex and I'll do some knowledge transfer about usual workflows (such as: preparing for release, code styling, where our ContinuousIntegration is placed and so on).

I hope, mc will rise again with new blood.

And I agree with Andrew: "It weren't worst 5 years in my life" Yeah, it was five happy years for me :)

WBR, Slavaz -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1 iEYEARECAAYFAlVlotoACgkQb3oGR6aVLpqysACfROPBo1/KrzNu73zwm8kpLTEI QbsAn2Gwet6bDc0FZc4nx4Gphsl4LSTE =QFDk -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

[Oct 29, 2013] Some 64 bit Farmanager plugin links by Justin Dearing

Mar 27. 2012 | Just A Programmer

I’ve previously written about my love of FAR, the File and ARchive manager. One of its greatest strengths is all the plugins written for it. However, some of the most popular plugins are no longer maintained (because they just work), and were not ported to 64 bit. Luckily, this is becoming less and less of an issue.

I have therefore compiled this short list of sites with 64-bit FarManager plugins. BTW these days U run nightly builds of Far3. Some of these plugins might not work in Far2.

UPDATES 2012-09-06:

[Oct 29, 2013] My new favorite tool, the Far File manager by Justin Dearing

Jun 21, 2010 | Just A Programmer

Installing Far and plugins.

Far is available on http://farmanager.com. There is a 1.7 and 2.0 version. The 2.0 version supports unicode asnd the 1.7 version us the legacy ascii version. You can get 64 bit binaries for both versions. You can install far via an MSI, or a 7-zip archive.

After you install Far, you will want to install several plugins. I will highlight my favorite ones here. ote that while binaries compiled against the far 1.7 SDK will work with Far 2.0, 32 bit plugins will not work with 64 bit far. For this reason you probably want to install the 32 bit version of Far, unless you are like me and like pain.

Except where mentioned, these plugins can either be found at the plugring site, or for 64 bit binaries, the evil programmers google code project. I will go through some of the plugins I like below.

7-Zip

As far as I know, there is no 64 bit version of this available yet. However, I probably just haven’t found it yet. If you install far without this plugin, you can browse the contents of most archives in Far. However, you will not be able to copy files out of them. I’ve yet to try getting the built-in archive support full working. However, with all the archives supported by 7-zip, I’m in no hurry to.

Event Viewer

This works like a text mode only version of eventvwr.exe. I’ve yet to find a truly compelling case to use it over the standar gui version. However, its nice to have an alternative tool for any job.

Service Manager

This is really convenient. It lists drivers and services temperately. It also allows you to edit things you can’t in the mmc snap-in, such as the path to the binary the service executes. Finally, it lets you create a new service. You rarely need to do this, but when you do its hard to find a good tool for the job.

User Manager

This one is really useful, especially on XP Home edition. Functionality is similar to the “Local Users and Groups” section of the Computer Management MMC snap-in on XP Pro. The thing I really love about it is you can set the “User must change password at next logon” flag on a user in XP Home Edition. I spent the good part of a train ride from Penn Station to Islip on Friday failing to achieve this in other ways. I’m not saying its the only way this task can be done. I’m just saying that this plugin will let me accomplish this task easily.

User Must Change Password At Next Logon

WinSCP

The arbitrariness of alphabetical order has put what is perhaps the most useful plugin last. There is a GUI scp/sftp client for windows called WinSCP. The author also made a Far plug-in based on the same code.

This plug-in, along with the 7-zip one, also take advantage of one of the most powerful intrinsic features of Far. With Far, you can copy any file from one panel to another, regardless of whether the panels contain a local folder, a unc path, the inside of an archive, or a sftp folder. Because of this, Far is a great tool for moving files to and from remote servers.

Conclusion

Far is a great file manager, and I will spend more time getting to know it. I think all programmers and sys-admins that work with Windows should get familiar with it as well.

[Apr 11, 2013] MC major changes and fixes since 4.8.7

What is funny is that the web page for Midnight Commander does not have a link to a stable release. I am assuming that all releases are now unstable ;-). In reality the last (more or less) stable version 4.8.1.7
Core:

[Nov 06, 2012] Windows XP+/32 bit native port of GNU Midnight Commander, based on the current 4.8.4 development stream.

Sourceforge.net

Windows XP+/32 bit native port of GNU Midnight Commander, based on the current 4.8.4 development stream.

Midnight Commander (also known as mc) is a free cross-platform orthodox file manager and a clone of Norton Commander.

Features include the ability work with common archive formats as if they were simply another directory, and to function as an FTP client. Midnight Commander also includes an builtin editor/viewer, features include syntax highlighting for many languages, macros, code snippets, simple integration with external tools, automatic indentation, mouse support, clipboard and the ability to work in both ASCII and hex modes.

Midnight Commander can also rename groups of files, move files to a different directory at the same time as it renames them. It lets the user specify the original and resulting file names using wildcard characters.

[Nov 05, 2012] NEWS-4.8.2 – Midnight Commander

Added new flag -X (--no-x11) to allow not to use X11 to get the state of modifiers Alt, Ctrl, Shift (#86)

[Nov 05, 2012] Mcedit allows to edit many files in one mcedit window 4.8.4 – Midnight Commander

[Nov 04, 2012] Multiple viewers and editors¶

Multi-screen feature: support of many opened editors and viewers (#1490)
You can concurrently run multiple viewers and editors (screens). Use following default hotkeys:
shortcut description
Meta + ` Show list of screens: viewers, editors and file panel
Meta + { Switch to previous screen
Meta + } Switch to next screen

Diff viewer 4.7.2

A built-in tool to visual compare and merge two files (#120, #2159)

[Oct 28, 2012] Re Creating Symlinks with defaul relative path


Am Freitag, den 28.09.2012, 15:37 +0200 schrieb Carsten Richter:
> Hi there,
> 
> When I am creating Symlinks in MC (using Ctrl-x s) i am spending quite
> some time for replacing the absolute by the relative one and I was
> wondering if it is possible to have the default path in the address line
> to be the relative one.
> 
> Is there such an option or can it be implemented?

I think Ctrl-x v does the job

> 
> Cheers,
> 
> Carsten

Re mc Digest, Vol 101, Issue 10

On Fri, 28 Sep 2012, chris glur wrote:

> }}Man, this rocks! Excellent job. Many problems and solutions discussed plus a
> lot of tips. And I like the presentation. I am proud to see LaTeX still leads
> to beautiful products. {{

Yes, it does. I am a mathematician, had to learn to use LaTex years ago, and still use it routinely.

> I vote for apartheid between the art-students and the computer-scientists.
> Surely nc/mc's intention was NOT to be arty.
> Which differs from "to be NOT arty". English is real crap. It's too arty.
> mc is for utility. We don't want to PAY for art.
> How much energy is needed to eg. extract text from your *.pdf/latex and
> insert it in email or USEnet or fax?

That part ought to be easy. Open a PDF file, and you ought to be able to do a mouse-copy of any part of the text and copy it into a text-based e-mail. Details of the procedure:

Open your mail program (I use apine these days) in an xterm. Fire up something like xpdf (file.pdf) in another xterm. Find the text you want to copy. Then mouse over it while holding down the left mouse button. If you start at the top left corner of whatever you want to copy and end at the bottom right corner, you will end up with a highlighted rectangular block. Then go over to the other xterm, where you are working on a mail to send to someone, and click the middle mouse button. The text within the highlighted block will then appear in your mail, starting at whatever point the cursor was in the mail program when you hit the middle button.

What is actually being used here, by the way, is basic functionality which is built into X. It is perhaps unfortunate that lots of people do not know this can be done with any X-conformant program. I myself did not know, for example, that it can be done for several years after I started to use Linux and X. The propagation of knowledge about this feature seems to proceed by the transmission of old folklore from those who know to those who apparently do not yet know, on an ad-hoc basis as is happening right now.

A similar transmission of old folklore was what informed me about this years ago. There was one of those sometimes-recurring discussions out there somewhere, started by someone moaning that X on Linux "lacks" the ability to do cut and paste. Some old timer pointed out that cut and paste is a fundamental feature of X. It just isn't done using Ctrl-C and Ctrl-V as it is in some other operating system, but instead it is done by using the mouse. Several people did not want to believe the old timer and said so in their responses. Me, I went and tried it, and it worked perfectly.

As far as the specific case of copying from a PDF into an e-mail is concerned, my most recent use of that was yesterday evening. The piece I copied was a rectangle containing a block of text from the right hand column of a two-column document, and I put it right into the e-mail. Thus, I assume that the same procedure would work equally well for you.

You can also use the mouse to copy, of course, from one linux terminal to another. Unfortunately, you can not copy out of X to a linux terminal by mouse-highlighting and then switching to the linux terminal. Neither can you copy from a linux terminal into an X session. Also if you have opened a file in a linux terminal with the mc viewer or editor you can mousecopy into it or from it to another linux terminal. But when mc is running in the terminal you have to push a Shift key while doing something with the mouse.

A recent feature (which is irritating because it is a new behavior) is that you still need to press the Shift key even if mc is put into the background with Ctrl-O. Until the most recent version of mc this used not to be the case. That is, if you put mc in the background and then started an app (an editor, for example) and you wanted to copy into it from another linux terminal, then one used not to need to remember that mc is running in the background. But now you have to remember that and use the shift key. I am sorry for this change and consider it more or less of a recently introduced bug. But I gu at I will simply have to adjust.

Hope that the above helps. Happy mouse-copying.

Theodore Kilgore

deselect text after ctrl+ins

Hello.

I am used to work with Debian Squeeze (mc 4.7.0.9) and now decided to try Ubuntu 12.04 (mc 4.8.1).

On debian ctrl+ins in mcedit deselects region to be copied (even when editor_persistent_selections=1), but not on Ubuntu. Is there an option in mc 4.8 to enable old behavior?

By the way, there are numerous issues to make mc work correctly under screen/tmux, and one of them is shift+fn.

I have managed to make them work by including following lines into mc.lib:

[terminal:screen]

copy=xterm

Thanks in advance, Sergey Naumov.

[Oct 19, 2012] MC 4.8.1 -- a landmark version of Midnight Commander

Internal editor and internal viewer are significantly improved in mc 4.8.1. mc 4.8.1 (and possibly some earlier versions after 4.6.2, I did not check) implement command window by swapping to shell making the implementation more correctly and this make mc more acceptable for Unix sysadmins in comparison with old implementation. They did not correctly implemented the context switch -- if you change directory in full command windows and press Ctrl-O to restore panel you will still see the old active panel. This is a bug that needs to be fixed (active windows should always display $PWD directory form the shell window).
Warning:
portability of mc was and still is poor due to glib dependencies so if your distribution uses mc-4.6.2.pre1-121.31.x86_64.rpm as RHEL 6 and Suse 11 do, you are stuck. Ubuntu and Debian users are the only which are probably OK. Among RPM-based distributions OpenSuse 12.2 has 4.8.1.3. Fedora now uses Systemd and is problematic in so many ways that it does not really matter what version of mc it is using. Cygwin has 4.8.1.6.

Congratulations to the development team !

Name Nickname Country Additional info
Andrew Borodin andrew_b Russia aborodin at vmail dot ru
Stan. S. Krupoderov iNode Russia pashelper at gmail dot com
Ilia Maslakov angel_il Russia (il.smind at gmail dot com)
Sergei Trofimovich slyfox,sjøtroll,skogtroll Belarus
Slava Zanko slavaz, slavazanko Belarus (jabber+gmail: slavazanko at gmail dot com)
Yury V. Zaytsev ZYV Germany

[Sep 28, 2012] Midnight Commander Guide

Everything is nice but implementation of third (command line) window remains completely screwed in Midnight Commander. This is the key OFM feature that Miguel de Icara never understood and we are still paying for that.
mailinglists@nawaz.org

I've written a guide to Midnight Commander in presentation format: http://nawaz.org/media/docs/mc/mc.pdf

For those who really don't want to look at the PDF and are just curious about the content, I put the HTML version here: http://www.nawaz.org/media/docs/mc/mc.html

It'll have a bunch of LaTeX formatting interspersed with the text, but much of it should be readable.

-- Be careful about reading health books. You may die of a misprint. - Mark Twain

Guus Bonnema:

Man, this rocks! Excellent job. Many problems and solutions discussed plus a lot of tips. And I like the presentation. I am proud to see LaTeX still leads to beautiful products.

Natalie

...Maybe you could add that the copy and move dialogs (F5 and F6) have a very useful history. With Alt-H you get a list of dirs that you have used earlier to copy or move to. Clicking with the mouse on the [^] at the end of the input line has the same effect.

xxx

Carsten Richter wrote:

> Nice work, there are some key bindings which don't work here, maybe due to my
> terminal emulator (such as Alt-‘). But for sure Ctrl-I doesn't redraw
> the display wenn it's messed up. I need to do the Ctrl-o twice.

It's Alt-` (backtick) and Ctrl-l (lowercase L). That should work.

xxx

Carsten Richter <richter-carsten@gmx.de> writes:

there are some key bindings which don't work here, maybe due to my terminal emulator (such as Alt-‘). But for sure Ctrl-I doesn't redraw

As someone pointed out, it's a backtick and Ctrl-L. I'll see if I can conveniently change the font where those key bindings are listed...

the display wenn it's messed up. I need to do the Ctrl-O twice.

Ctrl-L is somewhat common and good to remember. I think a bunch of other Linux programs use it.

I also would like to know how to change the default keybindings. I was able to change the autocompletion keybinding in an old mc using the "learn keys" option. But with never ones it's not working apparently.

I'm pretty sure there's a way - you'll find it in the release notes for some release in the last 2-3 years. I think I once found some places that describe how to change them, but it seemed quite painful. I only really wanted it to be able to sort files rather than having to go to the menu - but then they allowed sorting by clicking the headers, and that sufficed.

-- Heard the one about the dyslexic devil worshiper? He sold his soul to Santa.

Hallo, mailinglists:

there are some key bindings which don't work here, maybe due to my terminal emulator (such as Alt-?). But for sure Ctrl-I doesn't redraw

As someone pointed out, it's a backtick and Ctrl-l. I'll see if I can conveniently change the font where those key bindings are listed...

Helmut:

Just additional: sometimes (especially with some remote terminals) the function keys don't work. But (p.e.) esc 3 instead of f3 seems still to work.

[Sep 21, 2010] Pseudo-graphic border in MC problem

Should be LANG=C; mc That tip helps if you are using teraterm as emulator
gnome.apps.mc.general

> Please, a small question - I made the new installation (FC3, KDE)
> and run MC (the great SW!!). Everything works, except that borders on
> the panels are drawn by 'a umlaut' instead of pseudo-graphic (lines)

This is a locale and termcap issue which I do not fully understand.
Fortunately I do know a workaround. :) Use this:
LANG=C; mc
to start mc.

[Jul 26, 2010] Getting Midnight Commander line drawing to work with PuTTY andremiller.net

When using Midnight Commander with the default settings of PuTTY connected to my Ubuntu Linux machine the line drawing characters are all messed up.

After some experimentation it turns out that to fix it all you have to do is change your character set in PuTTY to UTF-8 and the problem is fixed. To do this open up the PuTTY settings and go to Window->Translation->Received data assumed to be in which character set: and change it to UTF-8.

After making this change you might have to force a redraw of the mc screen to show the new line drawing characters:

Also not that some fonts might not have the line drawing characters available. The fonts I know work is Courier New and Lucida Console. To change your font go to Window->Appearance, Font settings and click the Change button.

For reference, I was using using Midnight Commander 4.6.1 running on Ubuntu 7.10 and using PuTTY 0.59

[May 1, 2010] Midnight Commander 4.7.2

Core

Editor

Diff viewer

[Mar 1, 2010] Midnight Commander 4.7.1

Major changes since 4.7.0.1

Core

VFS

Editor

Viewer

[Dec 31, 2009 Midnight Commander

We've found some critical bugs (editor, x86_64, ...) in the previous 4.7.0 release, so we rushed out a minor bugfix 4.7.0.1 release now. Please upgrade if you happen to experience these.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year 2010! On behalf of the Midnight Commander development team

Slava Zanko

[Oct 2, 2009] Midnight Commander 4.7.0-pre3

Looks like the new team revitalized development of the old, stale codebase...

Major changes since 4.7.0-pre2

Core

VFS

Editor

Viewer

Misc

Fixes

[Aug 28, 2009] Midnight Commander release 4.7.0-pre2! by Slava Zanko

Changelog

Major changes since 4.7.0-pre1

Core

VFS

Editor

Viewer

Misc

The new release can be downloaded at the following URL: http://www.midnight-commander.org/downloads

[Aug 4, 2009] Midnight Commander release 4.7.0-pre1! by Slava Zanko

Download from http://www.midnight-commander.org/. New development team:

This release incorporates many code refactoring changes, user interface improvements, numerous bugfixes and new features.

Changelog

Major changes since 4.6.2:

Changes in the core

* Native UTF-8 support;
* Support for filename charset selection in panels;
* Reworked 'Find File' dialog;
* New unified search/replace engine with multiple search types: plain, wildcard, regexp and hex;
* Extended 'Learn Keys' capability;
* Locale-based codepage autodetection;
* Initial support for Doxygen generated docs;
* Build system updates (autoconf);
* Translation updates;
* Multiple x86_64 fixes.

Editor

* Various editor enhancements (mark/move/copy/paste vertical blocks);
* Multiple syntax file updates;
* Source code navigation through ctags/etags TAGS files;
* New option: 'Persistent selection';
* Delete/Backspace deletes selected block if 'Persistent selection' is off;
* Ability to shift blocks to the right with Tab key and to the left with Complete key if 'Persistent selection' is off;
* Show line numbers (optional);
* Highlighting of tabs and trailing spaces (optional);
* Added some hotkeys.

Miscellaneous

* Show free space on current file system;
* Show size of selected files in mini-status bar.

Bugfixes

* Editor undo fixes;
* Upstreamed many fixes from the distributions;
* Fixed segfaults on fish permission checks;
* Fixed fish symlinks handling and fancy names escaping;
* Various mc.ext fixes;
* Command line completion fixes (mainly escaping);
* Small fixes in history handling (locale independent .mc/history entries);
* Code cleanups, various memleaks fixed (many thanks to valgrind).

[Feb 3, 2009] Downloads – Midnight Commander

Bug-fix release 4.6.2 is now available.
mc-4.6.2.tar.gz Midnight Commander v4.6.2 md5sum: ec92966f4d0c8b50c344fe901859ae2a

[Feb 2, 2009] Midnight Commander wakes from deep sleep - News - The H Open Source News and Features

The Midnight Commander file manager developers have restarted work on the, once quite popular, file manager for the Linux/Unix console. Midnight Commander was inspired by the famous Norton Commander for DOS. In recent years, there had been no development at all, but now a "Bugfix Release" 4.6.2 has been made available. The new release, as the tag suggests, contains no new features.

[Sep 15, 2007] pre-release of GNU Midnight Commander 4.6.2 by Pavel Tsekov

I've just uploaded the tarball to ftp.gnu.org. 

   ftp://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/mc/mc-4.6.2-pre1.tar.gz
   ftp://ftp.gnu.org/gnu/mc/mc-4.6.2-pre1.tar.gz.sig
...This is release is mostly a bugfix release and some new features. 
Perhaps I could compile a list of changes if I get some free time...

[Sep 9, 2007] New MC maintainer

Pavel Tsekov becomes MC maintainer. He is probably the most active member of the current development team.
Hello,

I am writing this message to inform you that Pavel Roskin,
the long time maintainer and developer of GNU Midnight Commander,
decided to step down as a maintainer. I hope that you'll join me
to wish Pavel luck in whatever he pursues next.

The FSF following a recommendation from Pavel Roskin appointed me
as the new project maintainer. I hope that I'll be able to justify
their trust and live up to the expectations of MC's users.

Pavel Tsekov

[Aug 23, 2007] polishlinux.org » Midnight Commander in Action

A good introductory article

...Because MC is distributed with every known GNU/Linux system and as a port for BSD systems’ family, its installation is trivial and rely on making use of a favorite package manager. It suffices to issue the following command in Debian/Ubuntu systems:

apt-get install mc

In Fedora/CentOS/Scientific Linux/Red Hat systems:

yum install mc

... There is a possibility to run MC editor alone. You have to issue a mcedit command adding a file name with its path, e.g. mcedit /etc/fstab.

... ... ...

Apart from almost identical functionality, TC and MC enjoy different keyboard shortcuts. The table below shows comparison of the two groups.

Functions Midnight Commander Total Commander
Open directory menu CTRL + \ CTRL + D
Compare directories CTRL-X + D SHIFT + F2
Rescan (refresh panel contents) CTRL + R F2
Hide panels CTRL + O SHIFT + ESC
Reverse selection M + * NUM *
Find file ALT + ? ALT + F7
Quick view CTRL-X + Q CTRL+Q
Change file and directory rights - chmod Ctrl-X + C n. a.
Change file and directory owner - chown Ctrl-X + O n. a.
Make symlink Ctrl-X + S SHIFT+CTRL+F5

CTRL-X + D sequence must be issued by pressing together CTRL and X, and then D button - like in Emacs editor. A shortcut which should be mentioned here is ESC+0,1,2…9 which replaces all function keys F1 to F10. It is indispensable in terminals which do not support F1-F10 buttons.

... You can look into ISO images without prior mountings. All mentioned files are treated as directories. To view ISO contents it is enough to select it with a mouse or cursor keys and press Enter. MC offers additionally a quick-view option where contents of a selected file will be displayed in adjoining panel. The option is available through left/right menu options and bound to CTRL-X + Q shortcut.

... ... ...

...If you want to list all packages installed in your system enter “cd #rpms” in command line. After a while the list, grouped according to categories, will be shown in one of the MC’s panel. Similar ways can be applied to systems using DEB packages. It suffices to write in “cd #apt” or “cd #dpkg” to be able to look through all installed programs.

F10 key in GNOME-terminal

There is a conflict between GNOME-terminal and MC shortcuts. It concerns mainly F10 which closes MC, but is used to open upper menu in GNOME-terminal. In order to get rid of the nuisance the following command should be run:

gconf -set /apps/gnome-terminal/global/use_menu_accelerators \
 -type boot false

To have original settings one ought to change the false to a true option...

[Nov 25, 2006] Orthodox file managers - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The term eventually got into Wikipedia :-)

Orthodox File Managers (OFM), also known as Commander-like file managers, are the family of file managers based on the old Norton Commander interface.

The following features more or less define the class of orthodox file managers:

Other common features include:

All orthodox file managers have similar user interfaces. Interface varies among operating systems and graphic, text background. The orthodox file manager has two windows called panels where one is active and the other inactive. The idea is to manipulate files from active to inactive panel or within active panel. This gives user the ability to use only the keyboard, which makes the process much faster. Each panel shows information about the path (disk, folder, remote address...) and files with usually customizable columns that show relevant file information. Panels can be switched using tab key. Main sections of user interface are:

  1. path: shows the source/destination location of the directory in use
  2. information about directory size, disk usage and disk name
  3. panel with information about file name, extension, date and time of creation, last modification, permissions (attributes) and other
  4. info panel with number of files in directory, sum of size of selected files..
  5. tabbed interface (usually GUI file managers)
  6. function keys: F1–F10 have all the same functions under all OFM's: Example F5 always copies file(s) from active to inactive panel, while F6 moves the file.

Most functions are always available through shortcut keys. The introduction of tabbed panels to some managers made it possible to manipulate more than one action at the time. A frequently used feature is synchronization where multiple destinations can be updated from the same source. The ability to support many different archives, file systems and remote addresses made these file managers popular among administrators. The consistent interfaces made it possible to switch to any platform and be able to do the same work without much effort.

mc-light 4.1.40.p9_6* A lightweight Midnight Commander clone

Reaction to MC 6.x overcomplexity.

Maintained by: az@FreeBSD.org search for ports maintained by this maintainer
port added: 02 Sep 2004 12:26:58
Also listed in: misc

[Nov 2, 2003] Midnight Commander 4.1.X-MP by Oleg "Olegarch" Konovalov

Midnight Commander 4.1.X-MP

The goal of this project is creating a stable, well-working, usefull console-only version of well-known Midnight Commander, without bugs and garbage, like tk, xv and gnome. I'm bored waiting for bugfixes, and A'rpi's ESP team stops their work in this direction too, so I did it. I'm fixing all (found) bugs, reported by my friends, and made some really pleasent new features, like real-time clock, or filegroups colorizing.

Why is it an alternate version of mc, instead applying patches to main mc project?

The original mc is now about v4.6.x, with more and more bugs, "monster from the console" grows more and more, and now it has some very bad structural changes, tons of garbage code, and finally - there is no possibilities to compile it without some X parts, like Glib.

When I use linux - i want to use fast and powerfull console file manager, and I like mc 4.1.x series much better: it has well-designed structures, easy to add new features.

Btw. I back-ported some of new usefull things appeared in 4.5.x and 4.6.x, make some fixes, catch some memory leaks, and so on... - README gave you more information about it.

Index of -pub-Linux-utils-file-managers-mc-snapshots

version 4.5.55 was buggy (Andrew Samoilov patches helped a bit, but still...). This one is seems to be much better. Macros from the command line does not work properly ( try "cd %D" it should change to the directory of the unactive panel, but that it will not; Ctrl-x-p works).

Problems using function keys (F1 - F12)

Biju Chacko botsie at xfce.org
Wed Nov 24 05:46:18 UTC 2004


Benedikt Meurer wrote:
> Piotr Chmura wrote:
> 
>> Dnia Tue, 23 Nov 2004 12:49:53 -0800, Brian J. Tarricone  
>> <bjt23 at cornell.edu> napisał:
>>
>>> On 11/23/04 20:13, Rakotomandimby (R12y) Mihamina wrote:
>>>
>>>> Hello,
>>>> I mostly use mc as file manager for my remote server.
>>>> mc works with the function keys.
>>>> Unfortunately, for example i I want to quit mc, I have to press F10:
>>>> that makes tha terminal to pull down its menu.
>>>> How do you advice me to manage it ?
>>>> I want to keep the keys for mc.
>>>> I'm running the 4.2 version of XFCE (debian testing package from
>>>> os-cillation).>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> that would depend on what terminal you're running.  note that 'xfterm4'
>>> just runs xterm by default, or whatever your TERMCMD environment 
>>> variable
>>> specifies.  xfce doesn't come with its own terminal (yet).
>>>
>>> so essentially, the answer you're looking for is: either reconfigure
>>> your terminal to not use that key for menus, or, if that isn't possible,
>>> use a different terminal that doesn't use that key.
>>>
>>>     -brian
>>
>>
>>
>> In mc combination of pressing 'Esc' and then a number should work also...
>>
>> for example:
>> F4 <=> 'Esc' '4'
>> F10 <=> 'Esc' '0'
> 
> 
> If you use Terminal (the debian package is named xterminal), you can 
> disable F10 in Preferences -> Shortcuts.

If you use gnome-terminal (like I do) you can just switch off the menu. 
Then F10 works fine for mc and you can still access the menu by 
right-clicking on the term.

-- b
The svlug 2002-January Archive by Thread

Andrew V. Samoilov's patch collection for Midnight Commander (Russian) -- for v. 4.5.55 by Pavel Roskin

mc-cdrtools by Sami Lempinen

This utility contains four user menu entries for manipulating CD-Rs:

They are quite handy for quickly moving stuff over to a CD-R.

Note that mkisofs and cdrecord are required. You may want to edit the entries to suit your taste for the command line options for mkisofs, write speed and SCSI unit for cdrecord etc.

MCUtils for the GNU Midnight Commander

[Sep 23, 2001] nc.el

emulates famous Ms-Dos file browser in Emacs. Copyright (C) 1996 Stefan Hegny, Ilya Zakharevich Author: Stefan Hegny (hegny@fzi.de) with improvements by Ilya Zakharevich (ilya@math.ohio-state.edu) Available: ftp://ftp.math.ohio-state.edu/pub/users/ilya/emacs Suggested by Juhapekka "naula" Tolvanen

[Aug 24, 2001] GNU Midnight Commander 4.5.55

GNU Midnight Commander 4.5.55 has been released.

Development of the GNOME frontend will continue on the stable branch only:
"Branch_MC_4_5_x".  All GNOME support will be removed from the head branch
in the next few days.

NEWS:

- Mostly bugfixes and portability fixes.  Making things work as they
  were meant to work.

- Text edition improvements.
        - Ctrl-O supported in the viewer and editor.
        - Better terminal support.  Should not need "Learn Keys" on rxvt
          and xterm in most cases.

- GNOME edition improvements.
        - Find dialog rewritten.
        - Editor and viewer ask whether to save modified file when
          closed from window manager.

- Editor.
        - New syntax rules - S-Lang, PO files, Octave.
        - Alt-B goes to matching bracket.

- Portability improvements.
        - Should compile out-of-box on Cygwin and QNX Neutrino.
        - Can be compiled by BSD make.
        - Subshell and VFS code are safer and more portable.

- Experimental features (disabled by default).
        - Charset conversion support.
        - Large (64-bit) file support on 32-bit systems.


Homepage:

http://www.gnome.org/projects/mc/

The source tarball is currently available here:

http://www.gnome.org/projects/mc/mc-4.5.55.tar.gz

Note that the final location will be

ftp://ftp.gnome.org/pub/GNOME/stable/sources/mc/

Any help with moving the tarball to the final location (or giving me
access to do so) will be appreciated.

-- 
Regards,
Pavel Roskin

[May 25, 2001] Inside Solaris - Midnight Commander

A long time ago, on another computing platform, Peter Norton Computing released Norton Commander. This became my favorite file management program. As I wandered further and further into the UNIX realm, I found it hard to believe that a program like this wasn't available on UNIX. Finally, I came across Midnight Commander, as shown in Figure A. It offers more features than Norton Commander and, unlike Norton Commander, it runs on a variety of different computing platforms.

[May 24, 2001] Mc down the drain

Web site was not updated since September 2000. Project seems to be dead.

From: "Marc" <mphaan@hotmail.com>
Date: Mon, 18 Sep 2000 15:40:54 +0200

Where is Midnight commander?

I managed to download some old tar files but now there is no documentation. The link called "documentation" on the MC
site brings you to a website where documentation of some software group is managed.

Why isn't MC kept simple like it used to be? Wasn't that one of the the succesfactors of this piece of software?

Why is there not a simple procedure on the MC site that explains where to get it and how to install it even though the
redirected links are there?

Last question. What simple filemanager for the HP UNIX 10.20 could I use, where to download and how to install?

Mac
Re: Mc down the drain

From: Michael Schmidt <mschmidt@fh-koblenz.de>
Date: Tue, 19 Sep 2000 08:13:41 +0200

On Mon, Sep 18, 2000 at 03:40:54PM +0200, Marc wrote:
> 
> Where is Midnight commander?
> 
[...]
> Why isn't MC kept simple like it used to be? Wasn't that one 
> of the the succesfactors of this piece of software?

My personal point of view is that a few people have put too much 
graphics tittle-tattle and too much feature tittle-tattle into mc, 
would have been much better to stabilize mc's runtime solidity. 

> Why is there not a simple procedure on the MC site that explains 
> where to get it and how to install it even though the redirected 
> links are there?

Don't know, perhaps certain persons do not like that for any reasons.
Sorry, but one may get this impression.

> Last question. What simple filemanager for the HP UNIX 10.20 
> could I use, where to download and how to install?

The mc version I have compiled under HPUX-10.20 and which runs here 
until today without known problems is mc-4.5.33.
Feel free to get the sources tarball from our site at: 
ftp://ftp.fh-koblenz.de/pub/gnu/mc/

Have a nice day
Michael

[Jan 29, 2001] Linux Orbit - Features The LO Newbie Tests Mouseless (Midnight) Commander

[Dec 15, 2000] Advanced Midnight Commander

Suggested by Michael Smirnov <smb@mh.vstu.edu.ru>.

This is a bugfixed and enhanced version of the Midnight Commander 4.1.35. FTP is nearly rewritten, many small bugs are fixed, and some interesting features added, for example:
- Better syntax highlighting in editor
- Allow file/dirsize to be > 2GB
- FTP supports FXP (direct server-to-server connection)
- FTP transfers without copying to TEMP
- Fixed ZIPfs, added ESP support.

[Aug 21, 2000] Midnight thoughts about Midnight Commander

From: vda@vda.ilyichevsk.odessa.ua (Denis Vlasenko)
Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 02:04:43 +0300 (UKD)

Hi MC developers,

I am long standing user of Norton Commander and its clones. I have started using Linux recently and must admit that MC
helps me a lot to feel comfortable in this new and scary environment ;-).

I think maybe you're interested in newbie's impressions. I know that you've done a great program and don't expect you
to rush and implement all my wildest dreams. It will be interesting to hear your comments/explanations.

*** ESC key ***
>From FAQ:
>2.4 Why does the ESC key behave funny?
>   Midnight Commander uses the ESC key as a prefix for simulating the
>   Meta and Alt keys (for terminals which don't have Meta or Alt, see the
>   three previous questions). For example, pressing ESC-a is the same as
>   pressing Meta-a. In addition most terminals use ESC for internal
>   representation of arrow keys, function keys and other enhanced keys.
>   If you want to use ESC to cancel things you have to press it twice
>   i.e. ESC-ESC. If you find this cumbersome you can generally use F10 to
>   cancel. Alternatively turn on the old_esc_mode setting in the
>   ~/.mc.ini file. The old_esc_mode setting makes ESC work as a prefix
>   only if another key is pressed within 0.5 seconds. After 0.5 seconds
>   the ESC key cancels. There is no way to make ESC cancel immediately.

I found this ESC-ESC the most annoying thing in MC.

I understand that on some terminals this is really necessary.
But lots of people use Linux mostly at 386 PC consoles. I know
there's a way to remap keys on Linux (loadkeys etc).
Maybe Commander could remap ESC key to ESC-ESC while user
is in Commander shell and restore normal mapping
whenever user starts new program or terminates MC.
However, I see that it can be problematic:
1. What if MC gets SIGKILLed?
2. If keymapping affect ALL consoles, this wouldn't work
   without kernel modifications.


*** Panels on/off - Ctrl-O ***
Norton Commander and its DOS/Win clones usually have only one
command line. In MC we have two: one when panels are on and
one when they are off. It's confusing. I'm starting to hate
"Shell is already running a command" error box.
What is the reason it is done this way?

Also NC and clones usually allow to show/hide left and
right panel with Ctrl-F1,F2. It's nice to see output of previous
command(s) and file panel at the same time. Can it be done in MC?


*** Renaming/copy ***
Imagine you wanted to create directory named "MEMBENCH" but
typed it as "MEMBRNCH".
In NC you can hide other panel, press F6 and you'll see:
  Rename or move "MEMBRNCH" to:
  [MEMBRNCH                                      ]
You can fix your typo easily.
In MC after F6 you'll see:
  Move directory "MEMBRNCH" with source mask:
  [*                                             ]
  to:
  [/usr/local/and_whatever_other_panel_is_in     ]
Not that easy, eh?


*** Character 0x9B ***
I need to work with Cyrillic. Now my box loads necessary fonts
and keyboard mappings at startup. Everything is OK except for
one Cyrillic letter with code 0x9B. Yes, it's CSI.

Since Linux console provides VT100 emulation, it
tries to emulate some VT100 quirks too, including
CSI escape sequence:
  0x9B == ESC [
This is not 8-bit clean. I patched console.c in kernel
source tree and now  printf("-> \x9B <-")  does display character
with code 0x9B. I think it won't break anything, because
any decent program will print ESC [ sequence instead of
0x9B. What do you think?

However, MC does not display that character, althought
other Cyrillic chars are displayed.
How can I tell MC that it is now safe to print 0x9B?
In /etc/termcap? In terminfo database? Or I should patch
ncurses/SLang?

Also my box does nothing under MC when I press key bound to
emit 0x9B. Maybe it thinks it's a Meta-Escape?
I haven't a faintest idea how to make it work.


*** File Search ***
When I invoke M-? file search and press F3/F4 to view/edit files
found, I'd like to have F7 preloaded with the same search string
as in the M-? dialog.


*** FAR's F12 ***
One of the NC clones, namely FAR Manager, have a very useful feature:
you can switch to panels from viewer/editor and do what you need,
even open another viewer/editor! F12 brings list of currently available
'screens' and you can switch to any of them:
  [0.Panels                                     ]
  [1.View: /etc/fstab                           ]
  [2.Edit: /etc/inittab                         ]
  [3.View: /usr/src/linux/REPORTING-BUGS        ]
I found this very useful. Turns FAR into _multi-file_ editor.


*** Hiding cursor ***
It would be nice if MC would show cursor only when it is expected
that user can type something or toggle [x] checkboxes
and (*) radio buttons. It is more intuitive and saves some (however
tiny) CPU load when MC runs on framebuffer console or in xterm.


******
I'm not subscribed to any MC-related mailing list.
Please CC me if you decided to reply.
Thank you for your attention!
Have fun,
--
Denis Vlasenko
Email: vda_unique@iname.com

Re: Midnight thoughts about Midnight Commander

From: Vlad Harchev <hvv@hippo.ru>
Date: Thu, 10 Aug 2000 12:38:16 +0500 (SAMST)
On Thu, 10 Aug 2000, Denis Vlasenko wrote:

Hi, MC user :)

> Hi MC developers,
>
> I am long standing user of Norton Commander and its clones.
> I have started using Linux recently and must admit that MC
> helps me a lot to feel comfortable in this new and scary
> environment ;-).
>
> I think maybe you're interested in newbie's impressions.
> I know that you've done a great program and don't expect you
> to rush and implement all my wildest dreams. It will be
> interesting to hear your comments/explanations.
>
> *** ESC key ***
> >From FAQ:
> >2.4 Why does the ESC key behave funny?
> > Midnight Commander uses the ESC key as a prefix for simulating the
> > Meta and Alt keys (for terminals which don't have Meta or Alt, see the
> > three previous questions). For example, pressing ESC-a is the same as
> > pressing Meta-a. In addition most terminals use ESC for internal
> > representation of arrow keys, function keys and other enhanced keys.
> > If you want to use ESC to cancel things you have to press it twice
> > i.e. ESC-ESC. If you find this cumbersome you can generally use F10 to
> > cancel. Alternatively turn on the old_esc_mode setting in the
> > ~/.mc.ini file. The old_esc_mode setting makes ESC work as a prefix
> > only if another key is pressed within 0.5 seconds. After 0.5 seconds
> > the ESC key cancels. There is no way to make ESC cancel immediately.
>
> I found this ESC-ESC the most annoying thing in MC.
>
> I understand that on some terminals this is really necessary.
> But lots of people use Linux mostly at 386 PC consoles. I know
> there's a way to remap keys on Linux (loadkeys etc).
> Maybe Commander could remap ESC key to ESC-ESC while user
> is in Commander shell and restore normal mapping
> whenever user starts new program or terminates MC.

This would require root privileges.

> However, I see that it can be problematic:
> 1. What if MC gets SIGKILLed?
> 2. If keymapping affect ALL consoles, this wouldn't work
> without kernel modifications.

Also, mc runs on many unices, not only on linux.

>
> *** Panels on/off - Ctrl-O ***
> Norton Commander and its DOS/Win clones usually have only one
> command line. In MC we have two: one when panels are on and
> one when they are off. It's confusing. I'm starting to hate
> "Shell is already running a command" error box.
> What is the reason it is done this way?

Look at the way it's implemented: when subshell wishes to paint prompt, it
sends mc a signal (so it decides that shell completed running a command). If
you type one letter and then press backspace (i.e. completely clearing
commandline in subshell), shell won't redraw prompt, so mc will think that
it's running a command. So, just press enter in subshell when commandline is
empty but mc barks "Shell is already running a command".

> Also NC and clones usually allow to show/hide left and
> right panel with Ctrl-F1,F2. It's nice to see output of previous
> command(s) and file panel at the same time. Can it be done in MC?

No, it's nearly impossible to implement (terminal io is designed in a such
way).

>
> *** Renaming/copy ***
> Imagine you wanted to create directory named "MEMBENCH" but
> typed it as "MEMBRNCH".
> In NC you can hide other panel, press F6 and you'll see:
> Rename or move "MEMBRNCH" to:
> [MEMBRNCH ]
> You can fix your typo easily.
> In MC after F6 you'll see:
> Move directory "MEMBRNCH" with source mask:
> [* ]
> to:
> [/usr/local/and_whatever_other_panel_is_in ]
> Not that easy, eh?

I prefer to type 'mv ' and then "Ctrl-Enter" (or Escape-Enter) twice and
then edit the name in commandline in such cases.

>
> *** Character 0x9B ***
> I need to work with Cyrillic. Now my box loads necessary fonts
> and keyboard mappings at startup. Everything is OK except for
> one Cyrillic letter with code 0x9B. Yes, it's CSI.

> Since Linux console provides VT100 emulation, it
> tries to emulate some VT100 quirks too, including
> CSI escape sequence:
> 0x9B == ESC [
> This is not 8-bit clean. I patched console.c in kernel
> source tree and now printf("-> \x9B <-") does display character
> with code 0x9B. I think it won't break anything, because
> any decent program will print ESC [ sequence instead of
> 0x9B. What do you think?
>
> However, MC does not display that character, althought
> other Cyrillic chars are displayed.
> How can I tell MC that it is now safe to print 0x9B?
> In /etc/termcap? In terminfo database? Or I should patch
> ncurses/SLang?
>
> Also my box does nothing under MC when I press key bound to
> emit 0x9B. Maybe it thinks it's a Meta-Escape?
> I haven't a faintest idea how to make it work.

I don't know either.

>
> *** File Search ***
> When I invoke M-? file search and press F3/F4 to view/edit files
> found, I'd like to have F7 preloaded with the same search string
> as in the M-? dialog.

Yes, I would like to too. I hope somebody will hack this in.

>
> *** FAR's F12 ***
> One of the NC clones, namely FAR Manager, have a very useful feature:
> you can switch to panels from viewer/editor and do what you need,
> even open another viewer/editor! F12 brings list of currently available
> 'screens' and you can switch to any of them:
> [0.Panels ]
> [1.View: /etc/fstab ]
> [2.Edit: /etc/inittab ]
> [3.View: /usr/src/linux/REPORTING-BUGS ]
> I found this very useful. Turns FAR into _multi-file_ editor.

I think this will be difficult to implement in mc. Use 'screen' (window
manager for any terminal) or twin (nice window manager for linux
console or X terminal) to run several terminal sessions on one terminal.

>
> *** Hiding cursor ***
> It would be nice if MC would show cursor only when it is expected
> that user can type something or toggle [x] checkboxes
> and (*) radio buttons. It is more intuitive and saves some (however
> tiny) CPU load when MC runs on framebuffer console or in xterm.

Yes, I think it would be nice to implement this. But a lot of more important
things to do are waiting mc hackers. If you have time, welcome to hacking mc.

>
> ******
> I'm not subscribed to any MC-related mailing list.
> Please CC me if you decided to reply.
> Thank you for your attention!
> Have fun,
> --
> Denis Vlasenko
> Email: vda_unique@iname.com
>

Thanks for expressing your thoughts on mc.

Best regards,
-Vlad

mc.hlp in russian is available

From: Vlad Harchev <hvv@hippo.ru>
Date: Wed, 23 Aug 2000 21:14:24 +0500 (SAMST)

Hello, Pavel!

I just looked at the gnome cyrillization patch located at
ftp://ftp.comprice.ru/pub/linux/abiword.rus/gnomeoffcyr1.tar.bz2

It contains mc.hlp for mc-4.5.51 (fully?) translated to russian by Albert
Sultanov <sarras@mail.ru> (the size of mc.hlp is 178K, size of entire archive
is 1.67M). I put the mc.hlp for your convenience here
www.hippo.ru/~hvv/patches/not-mine/mc.hlp.koi8.gz

Pavel, could you consider integrating it into mc cvs?

Best regards,
-Vlad

Re How to compile Midnight Commander

Jim Balter wrote:
> 
> Bill Bartley wrote:
> >
> > Hi to all,
> >
> > I just installed the gnu-win32 system, and as my first project
> > I was trying to compile Midnight Commander using the configure
> > script. But - after a long struggle - configure exits with
> > no Makefile created, even though I mounted the drive with
> > the -m option which is supposed to prevent configure from
> > deleting the Makefile at the end of its processing.
> 
> Where did you here that?  The -m flag has no effect in the latest
> version of cygwin, and even if it did, it wouldn't have anything to
> do with configure deleting Makefiles; why would configure ever
> delete a Makefile after going to all the trouble of making one?
> 
> > Can configure actually work? Or do I have to create the
> > Makefile by hand? Any hints on how to do this?
> 
> Your chances of receiving help will increase if you bother to
> include useful information, like the output you got when you
> ran configure.  Generally, configure runs a bunch of tests,
> printing out the results of those tests.  It also produces
> a config.h, config.status, a config.cache, and config.log,
> which you should certainly examine, and finally, if all went well,
> a Makefile.  Odds are it didn't all go well, but you have not provided
> a single clue as to what might have gone wrong, and without telepathic
> or remote viewing powers no one reading the mailing list could know.
> 
> --
> <J Q B>

Jim, thanks for responding. Here is an answer to one of your questions,
plus the files you
suggested.

1. Why I thought configure may have deleted the Makefile:

(This is from faq.html#SEC22)

"Mixed Case Filenames

;-) 

Info-search tips for Midnight Commander users Linux Gazette

Mon, 31 Jan 2000
From: Ben Okopnik <fuzzybear@pocketmail.com>

Funny thing; I was just about to post this tip when I read Matt Willis' "HOWTO searching script" in
LG45. Still, this script is a good bit more flexible (allows diving into subdirectories, actually
displays the HOWTO or the document whether .gz or .html or whatever format, etc.), uses the Bash shell
instead of csh (well, _I_ see it as an advantage <grin>...), and reads the entire /usr/doc
hierarchy - perfect for those times when the man page isn't quite enough. I find myself using it about as
often as I do the 'man' command.

You will need the Midnight Commander on your system to take advantage of this (in my opinion, one of
the top three apps ever written for the Linux console). I also find that it is at its best when used
under X-windowsi, as this allows the use of GhostView, xdvi, and all the other nifty tools that aren't
available on the console.

Here's the script.

To use it, type (for example)

doc xl

and press Enter. The script will respond with a menu of all the /usr/doc subdirs beginning with 'xl'
prefixed by menu numbers; simply select the number for the directory that you want, and the script will
switch to that directory and present you with another menu. Whenever your selection is an actual file, MC
will open it in the appropriate manner - and when you exit that view of it, you'll be presented with the
menu again. To quit the script, press 'Ctrl-C'.

A couple of built-in minor features (read: 'bugs') - if given a nonsense number as a selection, 'doc'
will drop you into your home directory. Simply 'Ctrl-C' to get out and try again. Also, for at least one
directory in '/usr/doc' (the 'gimp-manual/html') there is simply not enough scroll-back buffer to see all
the menu-items (526 of them!). I'm afraid that you'll simply have to switch there and look around;
fortunately, MC makes that relatively easy!

Oh, one more MC tip. If you define the 'CDPATH' variable in your .bash_profile and make '/usr/doc' one
of the entries in it, you'll be able to switch to any directory in that hierarchy by simply typing 'cd
<first_few_letters_of_dir_name>' and pressing the Tab key for completion. Just like using 'doc', in
some ways...

Hope this is of help.

Midnight Commander tips

Midnight Commander - NC clone for Unix shell (!!!!!!!)
http://www.gnome.org/mc/
1) Esc-1 = F1 ... Esc-0 = F10
2) ^x-c - CHMOD (like Drabek's PROTECT).
3) Display Mode - contains submenu where you cal select full/brief, etc.
Under tree view there are subcommands:
f2 - rescan
f4 - static/dynamic - ?
4) TAB works, so does copy and delete.
5) Hotkey work in menus.
6) ^F - PgDn.
7) Filters work - ura!
8) 'Info about files' in right/display - same as Info in VC.
9) Options/menu file edit - 1st time you do this it creates
local menu for you!
I already defined a menu item! Woiks!
10) Dir tree - use right and left to move up and down level.
11) Find File - works.
12) Options/config/verbose - should turn off dialog for
copying file, but doesn't work.
13) ^U works (swaps panels).
14) Command history works.
15) What about speedsearch ?
16) Meta key is ESC, for example Esc-* inverts selection.
17) Installed on CRL - yay!
Reading FAQ...
18) In viewer: Space- PgDn, ^B - PgUp.
19) Found Netterm font that supports graf chars -
MS Linedraw!!! And garbage on the screen disappeared.
20) After pressing F9 you can access menu thru shortcut.
21) How to PgDn in fileman ? ^V and ESC V to go back, like EMACS.
22) How to ins filename in cmdline ? ESC-ENTER!
23) Cmdline history window - F9 c h. Only stores cmds that
are entered with panels on.
24) White '*' works to invert selection. And '+' works too.
25) Esc-Tab - filename completion. Press again to show
window of choices if prefix is ambiguous.
26) Gooky errmsg: 'shell is already running a command'.
Then segmentation fault comes if you ^O.
Sounds like bug.
27) Find out what 'network link' is for. It is for comp
that runs mcserv.
28) Checking TAR support - supposedly you can read it like dir (yay!) - works!
29) Closing FTP link - '..' in root dir. Same with TAR file.
O, ftp supports urls!
Can also do cd ftp://xyz - works!
This is very fast way to browse archives, because don't need to
dl thru modem. So is Lynx, though.
30) F9 C E - edit extension file.
31) I mapped by Inlink account - left panel CRL and right Inlink.
Vou!!!!!!!!!!!
Also, saved inlink as dir in hotlist.
Cannot rexec commands.
32) ESC-ESC is documented key - single ESC is used as Meta.
F10 also works as Cancel in dialogs.
33) View for man page does not work - 'terminal Tascii unknown'.
34) F9 O S - save setup.
F9 L F - left filter.
F9 C C - compare directories.
35) See if there is online MC manual. There is, on their homepage!
36) mc -c - color mode.
-v - load internal viewer (Use LIST alias).
37) Can pass 2 dir names to MC - for IPL.
38) If you have no permission to enter dir, MC quietly ignores your
attempt.
39) ^X P - pastes selected panel name into cmdline.
^X ^P - same for unselected panel.
^X T - paste names of selected files to cmdline - o, something
other commanders can't do!
^X ^T - for unsel panel.
ESC P, ESC N - goto to prev/next command in history.

ESC F, ESC B - move word forward/backward in cmdline (and this is
key for TCSH too, I bet... It is!).
^D - DELCHAR (TCSH too).
^K - ERASE EOL.
ESC BS - delword backward
40) ^T - tag file.
41) There is hint mode in MC - shows hints over cmdline.
42) You can map FTP drives to both panels and copy files directly.

More 2 Cent Tips & Tricks LG #81

Sat, 6 Jul 2002 13:40:26 -0500 (COT)
RE Otta (obob from qwest.net)
Previous Tip by Ashwin M (ashwin_n@gmx.net)
This is in reply to the LG issue 80, 2c Tip #18.

It is simpler to use Midnight Commander. Click on the rpm file like you would a directory and transverse the rpm as you would a branch of the directory tree. Locate the file or files and copy them to an actual directory with the copy button. Simple and effective!

[John Karns] I've found that some mc versions changed the rpm handling behavior. I had grown quite accustomed to viewing rpm contents and copying parts via mc, then after installing SuSE 7.1 on my laptop, was no longer able to view more than a partial list of the files in the rpm; specifically the rpm headers (description, etc.). I was able to correct the problem finding the mc scripts used for rpm handling, and changing one to agree with a previous mc version script.
One other point is that for very large rpm files (over 2 or 3 MB), the process can be very slow. When dealing with rpm files containing large tar balls of source code, I usually just "install" the rpm, which copies the desired file to /usr/src/packages/SOURCES.

mc-cdrtools by Sami Lempinen

This utility contains four user menu entries for manipulating CD-Rs:

They are quite handy for quickly moving stuff over to a CD-R.

Note that mkisofs and cdrecord are required. You may want to edit the entries to suit your taste for the command line options for mkisofs, write speed and SCSI unit for cdrecord etc.

More 2 Cent Tips & Tricks LG #51

Info-search tips for Midnight Commander users

Mon, 31 Jan 2000 14:57:13 -0800
From: Ben Okopnik <fuzzybear@pocketmail.com>

Funny thing; I was just about to post this tip when I read Matt Willis' "HOWTO searching script" in LG45. Still, this script is a good bit more flexible (allows diving into subdirectories, actually displays the HOWTO or the document whether .gz or .html or whatever format, etc.), uses the Bash shell instead of csh (well, _I_ see it as an advantage ...), and reads the entire /usr/doc hierarchy - perfect for those times when the man page isn't quite enough. I find myself using it about as often as I do the 'man' command.

You will need the Midnight Commander on your system to take advantage of this (in my opinion, one of the top three apps ever written for the Linux console). I also find that it is at its best when used under X-windows, as this allows the use of GhostView, xdvi, and all the other nifty tools that aren't available on the console.

Here's the script.

To use it, type (for example)

doc xl

and press Enter. The script will respond with a menu of all the /usr/doc subdirs beginning with 'xl' prefixed by menu numbers; simply select the number for the directory that you want, and the script will switch to that directory and present you with another menu. Whenever your selection is an actual file, MC will open it in the appropriate manner - and when you exit that view of it, you'll be presented with the menu again. To quit the script, press 'Ctrl-C'.

A couple of built-in minor features (read: 'bugs') - if given a nonsense number as a selection, 'doc' will drop you into your home directory. Simply 'Ctrl-C' to get out and try again. Also, for at least one directory in '/usr/doc' (the 'gimp-manual/html') there is simply not enough scroll-back buffer to see all the menu-items (526 of them!). I'm afraid that you'll simply have to switch there and look around; fortunately, MC makes that relatively easy!

Oh, one more MC tip. If you define the 'CDPATH' variable in your .bash_profile and make '/usr/doc' one of the entries in it, you'll be able to switch to any directory in that hierarchy by simply typing 'cd <first_few_letters_of_dir_name>' and pressing the Tab key for completion. Just like using 'doc', in some ways...

Hope this is of help.

Black screen after Ctrl-O

If you see a black screen after using CTRL+O в Midnight Commander you might benefit from setting everywhere (in .Xdefaults, /etc/X11/Xdefaults) option:
XTerm*VT100*titeInhibit: off

It might be that options in /etc/X11/Xdefaults has higher priority and does not always overright options in ~/.XDefaults

[Debian] When I work with MC via xterm there are some problems with keys

The first that you should do is to tune local and Xkb. Withouth it to tume mc keys is a lot of pain. If you have problem with Alt=<key> you need to modify /usr/X11R6/lib/X11/app-defaults/XTerm. At the end of the file you need to add:

*VT100*translations: #override \
 aReturn: string(0x1b) string(0x0d) \n\
 aTab: string(0x1b) string(0x09) \n\
 aspace: string(0x1b) string(" ") \n\
 aa: string(0x1b) string("a") \n\
 ab: string(0x1b) string("b") \n\
 ac: string(0x1b) string("c") \n\
 ad: string(0x1b) string("d") \n\
 ae: string(0x1b) string("e") \n\
 af: string(0x1b) string("f") \n\
 ag: string(0x1b) string("g") \n\
 ah: string(0x1b) string("h") \n\
 ai: string(0x1b) string("i") \n\
 aj: string(0x1b) string("j") \n\
 ak: string(0x1b) string("k") \n\
 al: string(0x1b) string("l") \n\
 am: string(0x1b) string("m") \n\
 an: string(0x1b) string("n") \n\
 ao: string(0x1b) string("o") \n\
 ap: string(0x1b) string("p") \n\
 aq: string(0x1b) string("q") \n\
 ar: string(0x1b) string("r") \n\
 as: string(0x1b) string("s") \n\
 at: string(0x1b) string("t") \n\
 au: string(0x1b) string("u") \n\
 av: string(0x1b) string("v") \n\
 aw: string(0x1b) string("w") \n\
 ax: string(0x1b) string("x") \n\
 ay: string(0x1b) string("y") \n\
 az: string(0x1b) string("z")

[svlug] About mc

Marc MERLIN marc_news@vasoftware.com
Sun Jan 20 23:45:02 2002


On Fri, Jan 18, 2002 at 11:23:13PM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote:
> Not quite.  While mc does have some keyboard rebinding as we went
> over the last time round, it doesn't support keyborad binding to the
> extent I want (rebinding alpha keys).  

True, just like vi, there are commands that you only get with
CTRL-X CTRL-key, and you can't change 'key' easily

On Fri, Jan 18, 2002 at 11:58:17PM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote:
> Loosely what I want is single pane, single directory view with the
> ability to interactively (in the move the cursor about and hit
> command keys sense) copy, move, rename, etc files with a very fast

which mc can all do, in a single pane if you wish.

> large file viewer that doesn't insist on loading them into memory.

Neither does mc's
I actually use mc's viewer to do binary in place edits, and they are done on
the right disk block without loading the file in memory.

> If the command keys are letter based (c=copy, d=delete, m-move,
> r=rename, etc I'm fine and configurability is not needed.  I don't

Different philosophy. With  mc, alphanum keys  go in the command  line since
you can build a command line at  all times (equivalent of the select command
line you  were talking about),  so obviously you can't  use c for  copy, you
have to use some other key.
But eh, you're fond of mc, regardless of technical attributes, so for you it
is going to be better.

> want to launch editors, run scripts, or handle spiffy regxes -- just
> text mode point, select, and shoot.  Not particularly interested in

mc does that.

> an internal command line.  Don't want help.  Copy destination can be

Well, you get both.

> typed in, or can be walked to and then copy invoked.  Can't think of
> any reason I'd be interested in ALT-TAB.

With  mc, you  can type  "cp", select  your files,  CTRL-X T,  and type  the
destination if you with (including tab completion)

> The emphasis is on speed and simplicity.  One of the things I really

Anyone who sees me use mc usually can't follow what I do :-)
It's all about knowing the tool.

On Sat, Jan 19, 2002 at 02:57:42AM -0800, Erik Steffl wrote:
> which offers better navigation (searching, marks etc)). I just tried to
> open 22MB file (kernel bz2) and it opened it in lot less then 1 second,
> so I am pretty sure it does not load the whole file into memory, at
> least not in the beginning.
 
It does not, you  can open /dev/sdax, and it'll load block  on demand, as it
should.

On Sat, Jan 19, 2002 at 01:36:32PM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote:
> The bindings I'd like would be something like:
> 
>   ENTER -- (on file) less, on directory CD
>   SPACE -- tag
>   C -- copy
>   D -- delete
>   M -- move
>   R -- rename (mv)
>   L -- hard link
>   Q -- quit
>   S -- sym-link
 
This is clearly incompatible with the command line feature in mc, which you
may not use, but that's not the point.
 
> I have use for a file manager no more than once or twice a month.

I can do complex  copies, moves and rename with mc faster  than you can type
them.

> > It is kinda arrogant from a program to not let you assign any
> > keybindings but IMO it's not serious usability problem.
> 
> I generally consider it critical.
 
I guess that's why you use emacs and not vi then :-)
I, for one, am  damn happy that vi users don't get to  remap all the keys to
anything they'd like, otherwise it'd be a complete mess.


On Sun, Jan 20, 2002 at 04:43:27PM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote:
> > in mc they are right in front of you. you don't have to learn
> > anything.
> 
> I find myself having to read the function key labels near every
> time.  I'd rather not, especially as they're abbreviated.
 
Tss, tss...
 
> Silly examples: The may MC handles cross-directory operations is the
> exact opposite of what I prefer.  mc requires the other pane to be
> on the target and the current pane to be the source.  Aaaargh!  That

That's how most  people seem to want  it, but if you really  want to, CTRL-U
will exchange both panes, but mc was  meant to emulate nc, so it does behave
the same as a result (only better)

> catches me almost every time.  The second confirm/edit/etc step
> under mc when doing a tagged file operation is something I've never
> wanted (or used) and would really like to never see.  

Well, then instead of complaining, you could go in the Options/Confirmation
menu, and disable them.

>   ObNote: I'd also much prefer it if mc left me in the directory it
>   was viewing when I exited, rather than the directory I started it
>   from.

Then it wasn't installed properly.
In Red Hat and Debian:
root@gandalf:~# type mc
mc is a function
mc () 
{ 
    MC=/tmp/mc$$-"$RANDOM";
    /usr/bin/mc -P "$@" >"$MC";
    cd "`cat $MC`";
    /bin/rm "$MC";
    unset MC
}

> Arguably that's little different from list.
> 
> > jojda:~>time mc
> 
>   $ time mc
>   real    0m0.469s
>   user    0m0.000s
>   sys     0m0.040s
 
On my system,
real    0m0.239s
user    0m0.050s
sys     0m0.020s

but who's counting?
Both are  plenty fast, and  quibbling about  sub second launch  time, coming
from an emacs user is middly ironic I think...

Marc
-- 
Microsoft is to operating systems & security ....
                                      .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking
  
Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/   |   Finger marc_f@merlins.org for PGP key

[svlug] About mc

Erik Steffl steffl@bigfoot.com
Sun Jan 20 23:49:01 2002


J C Lawrence wrote:
> 
> On Sat, 19 Jan 2002 23:58:50 -0800
> Erik Steffl <steffl@bigfoot.com> wrote:
> > J C Lawrence wrote:
> >> On Sat, 19 Jan 2002 02:57:42 -0800 Erik Steffl
> >> <steffl@bigfoot.com> wrote:
> 
> >> I have use for a file manager no more than once or twice a month.
> >> I'm not going to learn the keys, and if I do I'm unlikely to
> 
> > in mc they are right in front of you. you don't have to learn
> > anything.
> 
> I find myself having to read the function key labels near every
> time.  I'd rather not, especially as they're abbreviated.

  ? most of them are not:

1Help   2Menu   3View   4Edit   5Copy   6RenMov 7Mkdir  8Delete 9PullDn
10Quit 

  the only confusion is menu <-> pullDn (menu is user menu, pull down is
the application menu).

  a little bit more detail about function keys (Fn <-> esc-n):

  mc uses ctrl and meta modifiers, if meta is not available it uses esc
(esc, then key). since the function keys are not as common and generally
it's harder to make them work the meta n (n=1, ..9, 0) double the
function of Fn. So the safest bet is to hit esc-n, that should work in
most situations. I wasn't sure why you dislike function keys - if the
reason was that they are not as widely available (or don't work) then
esc-n would be a good solution.

  as far as speed goes you can also use meta-n instead, that way you do
not have to leave the home row. on debian (i386 arch) the meta seems to
be the window key (at least that's what it is on my system and I don't
remember doing any changes in this area). it's still not as good as
whatever you want it to remap to but it's somewhat better as far as
typing goes.

...
> > it doesn't limit you in any way and it's simpler than ctrl-z
> > etc. (nothing prevents you from using ctrl-z though).
> 
> Except that Ctrl-Z works everywhere, with everything.

  so use it with mc just like you would with list. it's hardly a fault
of mc that it provides additional functionality (that does not limit you
in any way).

...
> > generally traversing the directory trees is easier using file
> > manager (less keystrokes, you see what's happening)
> 
> TAB completion is your friend.  ido.el under (X)Emacs make it

  yes, but not a (boy)|(girl)friend/spouse, i.e. it's ok to have more
than one friend.

...
> > not modern destop design, modern desktop machines: there are no
> > space (HD or RAM) constraints that would excuse lack of readily
> > available on-line doc (man page, context sensitive help etc.). how
> > else would you learn how to use a program?
> 
> A man page is not context sensitive help.  However it, and perhaps a
> README, is enough for the majority of cases.  For the rest throwing
> something under /usr/share/doc handles most other cases.

  for a gui program there is no excuse not to have context sensitive
help. why should a user have to go someplace else and go through
irrelevant info when program knows exactly where the user is a can
provide relevant help information?

> >> SELECT <file-spec> <command>
> >>
> >> Brought up a scrolling text list of the matching files which
> >> could be cursored among and tagged/untagged with SPACE.  Hitting
> >> ENTER ran the provided command on all tagged entries.
> >>
> >> That alone under bash would remove 90% of my need/wish for a file
> >> manager (I faintly understand you can do something not entirely
> >> dissimilar under zsh, but I haven't looked into that yet).
> 
> > it's not exactly the same but that kind of functionality is
> > covered by command line auto-completion,
> 
> Aye, that's a standard (and heavily used) feature here.  it doesn't
> do much however for the "I want to run this command on some
> arbitrary selection of those files" case.

  mc can be used then, even though the order of operations is slightly
different:

  1: mc
  2a: select files
  2b: type the command
  3: hit ctrl-x t<enter>
  then F10 if you don't want to use mc anymore...

  it has the same effect as you describe, it's a little bit less
effective as far as typing goes (but not much) - it shouldn't matter if
you use it rarely, if you'd use it more often you would probably already
be in mc.

  2a and 2b can be done in any order.

  2a: there are several ways to select files you want to use:

    insert tags/untags files
    + enables you to type in shell patter or regexp (configurable)
    meta-? is a simple version of find+grep
    ctrl-x ! let's you run any program that returns list of files (e.g.
find)

  you do not have to use all the fancy file picking mechanizms, if you
want to stay simple you can use insert and possibly +

  3: you can edit the resulting command line before hitting enter
(unfortunately not using your shell, it gets into shell history though).

  you have to know the ctrl-x t spell though. then again, you have to
know select if you want to use it so it's basically the same (and
there's context sensitive help in mc when you forget the keybinding).

  note that while what I describe is somewhat complicated you can use it
in very simple form, in that case it's basically the same as select. the
additional functionality does not stand in your way...

...
> Err, to repeat the point, I don't.  File management is perhaps less
> than 3% of my time, if that.

  what I was saying is that I am not all the way on the other side (as
you suggested). In fact if it weren't for mc I would probably use file
managers less than 10% (at least that was the case before I've found mc)
and be quite happy.

...> > I don't get it. What is it that LIST does that mc does not?
> 
> Faster, smaller, lighter, more unobtrustive, easier/more-intuitive
> cross-directory operations, default/expected key bindings, less
> cruft.  I don't want a swiss army knife.  I just want a small fruit
> knife.


  smaller: yes (but who cares?)

  faster: NO, see the timing of startup/exit below, and there doesn't
seem to be any detectable speed difference during operation.

  more unobtrusive: mc even let's you work in your shell, how can it be
any less obtrusive? you can have nothing but panel on the screen...

  intuitive: list is not intuitive at all, without using the help screen
you wouldn't be able to do almost anything. 'c' does not copy. v is for
NV (arc viewer) [linux version, IIRC it is somewhat better in DOS
version] etc. mc is not anymore intuitive than that but at least it is
easy to get help, it displays basic keys on the screen (if you want it
to) and lot of keys are the same as nc uses (which is/was sort of de
facto standard)

  cross directory ops: linux list doesn't seem to have any. haven't find
a way to copy a file (intuitive???). what I remember from dos version is
that it brings up dialog where you can type in the destination, which is
exactly what mc does. mc provides the oposite panel's directory as
default but you can start typing your own destination right away so it
doesn't slow you down at all, it even provides auto-completion
(meta-tab).

  key bindings: list definitely does NOT provide expected key bindings,
specially the linux version. the dos version - perhaps and if you like
those then that's a valid point against mc. still - you cannot change
them so how is it that you know what to expect when you hit r? is it
remove or rename? intuitive?

  the knife analogy is not a valid one in this case. the extra
functionality of mc does not come at significant cost - the only
difference is that the program is bigger, it does not have almost any
difference on start-up time (that's the only possible difference). the
HD space it takes up is not of concern (today and even less concern in
the future). How is the extra functionality of mc standing in your way?
If you don't know about the extra keybindings you simply don't use them.
What's the problem?

...
> >> mc enforces a UI which I find nearly unusable and supports a raft
> >> of features that I find distracting from what I'm
> 
> >  ? every UI program enforces its UI. every CLI program enforces
> > its UI as well. LIST does. not sure why you are singling mc out.
> 
> Because I don't like mc's choices?

  in one panel configuration it is basically the same as list...

...
> Silly examples: The may MC handles cross-directory operations is the
> exact opposite of what I prefer.  mc requires the other pane to be
> on the target and the current pane to be the source.  Aaaargh!  That

  (sort of repeated from above) no it does not. it just provides it as
default, you can immediately type in your own destination just as if the
default wasn't there. it even provides auto-completion. what more (or
less) do you want? how is list better than that?

> catches me almost every time.  The second confirm/edit/etc step
> under mc when doing a tagged file operation is something I've never
> wanted (or used) and would really like to never see.

  you get the same dialog in list. how else would you specify the
destination? it does not make any sense. what do you mean?

>   ObNote: I'd also much prefer it if mc left me in the directory it
>   was viewing when I exited, rather than the directory I started it
>   from.

  list or any other program does not do that either. and cannot. that's
why cd is internal shell command (child cannot change the parent process
environment, cwd etc.)

  however, there's a sort of solution for this, here's a relevant quote
from man page:

      -P     At  program  end, the Midnight Commander will print
              the last working directory.  This  function  should
              not  be  used  directly, instead, it should be used
              from a special shell function that  will  automati­
              cally  change the current directory of the shell to
              the last directory the Midnight  Commander  was  in
              (thanks  to Torben Fjerdingstad and Sergey for con­
              tributing this function and the  code  implementing
              this      option).       Source      the      files
              /usr/lib/mc/bin/mc.sh (bash and zsh users)  respec­
              tively /usr/lib/mc/bin/mc.csh (tcsh users) in order
              to have this function defined.


> > you can fire it off anytime you want and quit it with single
> > keystroke, it's not a monster that would take forever to start up:
> 
> Arguably that's little different from list.
> 
> > jojda:~>time mc
> 
>   $ time mc
>   real    0m0.469s
>   user    0m0.000s
>   sys     0m0.040s
> 
>   $ time list
>   real    0m0.098s
>   user    0m0.070s
>   sys     0m0.020s

jojda:~/skusobna/list>time ./list
0.010u 0.000s 0:00.10 10.0%     0+0k 0+0io 217pf+0w
jojda:~/skusobna/list>time mc

0.020u 0.000s 0:00.10 20.0%     0+0k 0+0io 388pf+0w
jojda:~/skusobna/list>

  I compiled the list (crowe's version for linux) and above are the
results on my machine. I would say that you cannot distinguish between
list and mc (as far as start-up time goes). Not sure how to measure
anything else but from visually judging the speed I don't think there's
any significant difference.

  btw on your computer it says that real time was 0.469s while the sum
of other times was a lot less - that means that there was something else
going on on the system. Or perhaps it was waiting for a disk to load the
file (mc itself, that would mean that you'd have to wait for about .5s
when you start mc first time/after a very long time - that's not such a
big deal).  Since I already ran mc I obviously cannot test the first
start right now...

> No promises on not having a slow finger, tho I tried not to.
> 
> > you can even run it with command line, it's not some internal
> > funky CLI, it's your login shell, basically unchanged, you just
> > hit ctrl-o to make panels disappear (but you _don't_ _have_ to use
> > this feature, you can just quit mc or use ctrl-z)
> 
> I like the bash command line and want it to be my default CLI UI.

  good. as far as comparison between list and mc goes: mc is basically
the same but provides you with you shell even from within mc (and yes,
it's bash shell (or whatever your login shell is), not some internal
funky shell).

> Nothing else, just bash as configured by my .bashrc, under an xterm
> as configured (and keys re-bound) as per my .Xdefaults.  I like
> that and would like to stay with it, augmenting it only in the areas
> mentioned, not replacing or changing large chunks of it.

  OK. that's what I do as well. whether you augment it using list or
using mc there's no difference in obtrusiveness, I would argue that mc
is less obtrusive because it lets you use you shell even when you run mc
(again, this functionality does not come at a price - if you don't want
it just don't use it, it does not prevent you from using ctrl-z or quite
mc etc.).

> > also: menu bar, command line, status line, hint line can all be
> > turned off so you're left with panel(s) only.
> 
> I'd rather (almost always) have visible the bottom end of scrollback
> (usually the last 20 or 100 lines depending on window size, with a
> further 5K lines available under PgUp/PgDn)).  That I find useful
> and use dozens of times a day.  The vast majority of the time I
> don't have a use for the panes.

  so at those time do not run the file manager or use ctrl-o with mc (or
ctrl-z), that's what I do as well. have an xterm, sometime run mc in it,
depending on what I do. when I want to use command line again (in the
same xterm) I either quit mc or use ctrl-o (depending on what I think I
will be doing).

  ctrl-o has an advantage of keeping the directories of shell and mc in
synch - if you are in mc and change directory the shell's cwd changes as
well, if you hit ctrl-o and cd in shell the mc's cwd changes too (that
wouldn't happen if you used ctrl-z). again: you do not have to use this
feature and it doesn't cost you anything... IMO it makes perfect sense,
specially for people who do significant amount of work using command
line but that's just me - you might not find it useful and you do not
have to use it (or even know about it). it's not forced on you.

> > mc is not an integrated solution.
> 
> We disagree.

  how is mc more integrated solution than list? you can use it in the
same way that you use list (in principle, it's, of course, not exactly
the same).

> Stylistically I'd prefer something that handled mail far closer to
> the way MH approaches handling mail than the way that any of the
> mbox-based tools do.

  what is this about? and BTW as far as email goes the best way to store
it is to use IMAP (which IIRC is what you do, or at least advocate).

> >> Hurm.  John Crowe's list (OSS) seems a fairly good starting
> >> point.  Its got most of the basic supports there already.  I
> >> really should take some time off and just hack it into shape.
> 
> > he recommends mc as well:-) just checked the web page.
> 
> Yeah, I know.
> 
> > the more you're explaining the more I find your position strange.
> > everything that you write (apart from keybindings configuration)
> > points to mc. yet you don't like it. is it something personal?
> 
> Nope, just what I've written.

  but based on what you've written you want mc! (overall, apart from the
keybindings) I am quite confused - what you're saying about how you work
makes sense (I work in similar way even though not on the same kind of
tasks) but when it comes to mc you're suddenly strange... well, one way
or another, I guess that's it from me, I hope you didn't find it too
pushy... (=unless you want to continue discussion I am not goin to
continue with my mc evangelism).

	erik

[svlug] About mc

Erik Steffl steffl@bigfoot.com
Mon Jan 21 02:18:01 2002


J C Lawrence wrote:
> 
> On Sun, 20 Jan 2002 23:48:18 -0800
> Erik Steffl <steffl@bigfoot.com> wrote:
...
> > mc provides the oposite panel's directory as default but you can
> > start typing your own destination right away so it doesn't slow
> > you down at all, it even provides auto-completion (meta-tab).
> 
> Arrrgh.  Why not TAB like everything else?  Why M-TAB?  Yeesh!
> (don't answer that, I know the answer, I just don't like it).

  actually that's one key-binding you can redefine in learn keys dialog
(all others are basically keys, just this one is sort-of-function
completion/m-tab). the consequence is that you cannot use tab to move
between panels (AFAIK you have to use mouse) but if you only use one
panel it might not matter that much (tab is also used in dialogs but you
can use arrows for that).

...
> I'll assume from prior comments that you use vi instead of XEmacs.
> Why?

  not sure, I learned it first, then I discovered vim and I am quite
happy with it, don't feel that everything has to be part of editor, I
rather use external tools.

> Take your answers and apply them in reverse and I suspect you'll
> find many of my reasons for not wishing to use mc and looking for a
> much more vi-like tool (well, minus vi key bindings).

  as I see it you want ed instead of vi:-)

  I mean I understand if you don't want to use nautilus or some other
megaloman of a filemanger but mc? it is lean and mean and does
filemanagement, doesn't have a flight simulator in it or programming
language or whatever extra stuff that some other programs include (not
that there's anything wrong with that, it's just that not everybody
likes that style)

...
> In mc:
> 
>   In pane 1 tag some files.
> 
>   Move to pane 2
> 
>   Navigate to a directory.
> 
>   Hit copy key (forget what it is).
> 
> Fails.  Why?  mc requires focus to be in the source of the tagged
> operation, not the target.

  that's because that's how it works basically everywhere. even in list,
you select source, hit c, specify target; apart from the patological
case you described (if directory is selected, the tagged files are
copied into it).

...
> If I haven't indicated, in any possible way, a target, then I can
> live with a dialog.  If I have indicated a possible target, for
> instance by having the cursor on a dir (LIST behaviour), then use
> that and don't ask me.

  that's not possible* when using two panels (it might be a possible
enhancement of single panel mode), it's also surprising because that's
not how it works in most other applications (and somewhat inconsistent)

  * it is possible but would be even more confusing than when it's a
single panel, it would also mean that you basically have to go to target
panel before copy/move etc., quite a mess.

> >> ObNote: I'd also much prefer it if mc left me in the directory it
> >> was viewing when I exited, rather than the directory I started it
> >> from.
> 
> > list or any other program does not do that either. and
> > cannot. that's why cd is internal shell command (child cannot
> > change the parent process environment, cwd etc.)
> 
> Actually you can but you need to use a wrapper ala the one Marc

  hey, that's what I posted as well (a quote from man page).

	erik

[svlug] About mc

J C Lawrence claw@kanga.nu
Mon Jan 21 12:14:01 2002


On Mon, 21 Jan 2002 01:51:22 -0800 
Erik Steffl <steffl@bigfoot.com> wrote:
> J C Lawrence wrote:
>> On Sun, 20 Jan 2002 23:48:18 -0800 Erik Steffl
>> <steffl@bigfoot.com> wrote:

>> Take your answers and apply them in reverse and I suspect you'll
>> find many of my reasons for not wishing to use mc and looking for
>> a much more vi-like tool (well, minus vi key bindings).

>   as I see it you want ed instead of vi:-)

For a file manager?  Kinda, yes, tho more in an MH style.

> I mean I understand if you don't want to use nautilus or some
> other megaloman of a filemanger but mc? it is lean and mean and
> does filemanagement, doesn't have a flight simulator in it or
> programming language or whatever extra stuff that some other
> programs include (not that there's anything wrong with that, it's
> just that not everybody likes that style)

I want leaner and meaner, and far more atomic.

>> In mc:
>> 
>> In pane 1 tag some files.
>> 
>> Move to pane 2
>> 
>> Navigate to a directory.
>> 
>> Hit copy key (forget what it is).
>> 
>> Fails.  Why?  mc requires focus to be in the source of the tagged
>> operation, not the target.

> that's because that's how it works basically everywhere. 

I can't comment on everywhere, but I've not noticed that behaviour
in other tools before and its not the way I expect or want.

> even in list, you select source, hit c, specify target; apart from
> the patological case you described (if directory is selected, the
> tagged files are copied into it).

Uhh, but that is a way of specifying target.  If I run mc in dual
pane mode, and do the above, why shouldn't/wouldn't it accept it as
a default/intended target?

>> If I haven't indicated, in any possible way, a target, then I can
>> live with a dialog.  If I have indicated a possible target, for
>> instance by having the cursor on a dir (LIST behaviour), then use
>> that and don't ask me.

> that's not possible* when using two panels

Sure it is.  Just take the above example and have the copy work.

> (it might be a possible enhancement of single panel mode), it's
> also surprising because that's not how it works in most other
> applications (and somewhat inconsistent)

Oddly enough its exactly what I expect and is what seems most
obvious to me:

  Okay, I want these files >here< and I want to move them over, umm,
  (fiddle, fiddle, fiddle) yeah, over here.

mc dictates instead:

  Okay, I want these files >here< and I want to move them over, umm,
  (fiddle, fiddle, fiddle) yeah, over here, but oh yeah, where were
  those files again?

Can't comment on any other applications.  Inconsistent?  

>   * it is possible but would be even more confusing than when it's
> a single panel, it would also mean that you basically have to go
> to target panel before copy/move etc., quite a mess.

No.  Just have both work.  If there is a second panel, always accept
it as the default target of a copy, no matter where focus is UNLESS
the cursor is on a valid target (eg directory) in either panel, in
which case accept that instead by default (as long as its not
tagged).

				-+-

I wandered thru http://chuck.burkins.net/LinuxFile.html yesterday.

  Asides from being X11 based SFM is rather nice.  Pleasingly small
  and pleasingly hackable.  Wish it were text mode.  Basic key
  bindings can be lived with, but can be changed (source edits)
  without too much difficulty.  There's a .deb as well.  

In looking thru sunsite/ibiblio I found hm:

  http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/Linux/utils/file/managers/hm-3.1.tar.gz

Fairly promising.  Will need some source hacking to fix the key
bindings and get rid of the confirms on things like `rm`.
Annoyingly it fails to respond to window resizes which I do a lot
of.

More interestingly zselx approaches the SELECT problem.  

  http://www.ibiblio.org/pub/Linux/utils/file/managers/zselx-1.1.tar.gz

I need to play with it more.  It would be considerably nicer if it:

  -- accepted the command to run on the command line
  -- accepted a filespec (eg *.c) instead of just a directory spec.
  -- could accept multiple filespecs on the command line
  -- could accept the list of files to display from stdin (kinda
  tough with a CURSES app I know)

-- 
J C Lawrence                
---------(*)                Satan, oscillate my metallic sonatas. 
claw@kanga.nu               He lived as a devil, eh?		  
http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/  Evil is a name of a foeman, as I live.

[svlug] About mc

Marc MERLIN marc_news@vasoftware.com
Mon Jan 21 14:01:01 2002


On Mon, Jan 21, 2002 at 12:19:24AM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote:
> Quite.  For what you do, especially as a SysAdm, mc is invaluable.
> I, umm, don't tend to do that much SysAdm, especially not on a daily
> basis.
 
Fair enough.
 
> I just checked, and perhaps I'm missing something in playing just
> now, but I don't see anything in the options that disabled (for
> instance) the dialog on a tagged copy which asks:
> 
>   Copy # files with source mask to:
> 
>   To: 
 
I  thought you  were talking  about confirm  delete/overwrite and  so forth.
Indeed, for copy and move, you do  get a window, but it's not a confirmation
window, it's  a window that  lets you change  the destination (if  you don't
want to be using  the second pane), lets you rename  files by regex patterns
are you copy/move them, select how  to copy symlinks and file attributes and
so forth.
 
> > Then it wasn't installed properly.  
> 
> On a Debian system:
> 
>   $ type mc
>   mc is /usr/bin/mc
 
You are right, it's a damn shame. I guess I forgot that on all my debian
systems, the function came from me.
On Red Hat and other distros, the function gets installed with the package.
 
On Mon, Jan 21, 2002 at 12:23:12AM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote:
> On Sun, 20 Jan 2002 23:42:53 -0800 
> Marc MERLIN <marc_news@vasoftware.com> wrote:
> 
> > I, for one, am damn happy that vi users don't get to remap all the
> > keys to anything they'd like, otherwise it'd be a complete mess.
> 
> Why?  I assume you would never use that capability, but those that
> would, could, and their user-local configs (~.vimrc?) would not
> affect you unless you logged in as them for some reason (in which
> case you get what's coming to you).

I guess I'm biased because I get to experience that when the user comes and
asks for help and that I have to use their keyboard.
It's just  as annoying than a  user with a  DVORAK keyboard who needs  me to
type on their keyboard.

Marc
-- 
Microsoft is to operating systems & security ....
                                      .... what McDonalds is to gourmet cooking
  
Home page: http://marc.merlins.org/   |   Finger marc_f@merlins.org for PGP key

[svlug] About mc

J C Lawrence claw@kanga.nu
Mon Jan 21 14:21:01 2002


On Mon, 21 Jan 2002 14:00:07 -0800 
Marc MERLIN <marc_news@vasoftware.com> wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 21, 2002 at 12:19:24AM -0800, J C Lawrence wrote:

>> Why?  I assume you would never use that capability, but those
>> that would, could, and their user-local configs (~.vimrc?) would
>> not affect you unless you logged in as them for some reason (in
>> which case you get what's coming to you).

> I guess I'm biased because I get to experience that when the user
> comes and asks for help and that I have to use their keyboard.
> It's just as annoying than a user with a DVORAK keyboard who needs
> me to type on their keyboard.

Hurm, an option to define what RC to use would seem to solve that
(eg point i at yours).

-- 
J C Lawrence                
---------(*)                Satan, oscillate my metallic sonatas. 
claw@kanga.nu               He lived as a devil, eh?		  
http://www.kanga.nu/~claw/  Evil is a name of a foeman, as I live.

How to avoid launching Midnight Commander by accident Linux Gazette

Commander by accident
Mon, 26 Feb 2001 10:31:51 -0500

Allan Peda (apeda from linkshare.com)

I've typed "mc foo bar" one time too many when I really meant to type "mv foo bar". Removing Midnight
commander is not an option, because that breaks some file exploror type GUI utilities, so I cooked up a
bash script to double confirn that I wanted to type what I (probably mis-)typed :

Recommended Links

Softpanorama hot topic of the month

Softpanorama Recommended

Old home Pages:
http://www.gnome.org/mc/ -- now defunct, see http://www.ibiblio.org/mc/
RPM resource mc

mc videos

 

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GNU Midnight Commander File Manager

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macosxhints - 10.3 Install the GNU Midnight Commander from source

Solaris:

Inside Solaris - Midnight Commander  -- pretty basic paper

A long time ago, on another computing platform, Peter Norton Computing released Norton Commander. This became my favorite file management program. As I wandered further and further into the UNIX realm, I found it hard to believe that a program like this wasn't available on UNIX. Finally, I came across Midnight Commander, as shown in Figure A. It offers more features than Norton Commander and, unlike Norton Commander, it runs on a variety of different computing platforms.

Please note that you need to use bash for mc: some capabilities like an integrated shell windows (Ctrl-O) does not work with ksh or other shells.

Precompiled MC can be downloaded from http://sunfreeware.com/.
Attention: before installation glibc needs to be installed. After that check LD_LIBRARY_PATH. It should include the target directory (/usr/local/lib).
Other possible sources of MC for Solaris include:

BSD:

HP-UX: Software Porting And Archive Centre For HP-UX

Etc:  HTTP Virtual File System



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